Is there reason to be worried about the Marvel Universe?

Is there reason to be worried about the Marvel Universe?

We know the Avengers knocked it out of the park, but was that the last big thing they do?

Editorial Opinion
By GinjaNinja - Aug 08, 2013 07:08 AM EST
Filed Under: Avengers

This is just a short article about some things me and a friend of mine have been talking about.

Marvel has done a fantastic job of making their films funny yet action packed. They haven't really seemed to have a flop so far. The Incredible Hulk and Iron Man 2 are probably their lower end films but both seemed to pass as "Good movies" or at least watchable. But it is time to start to worry? Thinking about it even though they haven't flopped, they haven't really knocked all of them out of the park. Iron Man and the Avengers have been near perfect movies. But Iron Man 3's Mandarin kinda screwed that one up, and now we hear Ultron is getting a change as well from Hank being his daddy. I don't know about you but I have a bad feeling that between Guardians, Ant-Man and Thor, we could see a flop possibly. So do we have reason to question if this world is really going to pan out well? If Thor nails it would put them back on the right track, Possibly making more money than Man of Steel. But with the fact that Iron Man 3 has made quite a few of us mad, Thor really does need to go well or this could be close to tanking fast.

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Highflyer
Highflyer - 8/8/2013, 8:29 AM
The incredible huk is so underrated. I honestly think it is one of marvel's best.
GinjaNinja
GinjaNinja - 8/8/2013, 9:06 AM
@omega I guess I agree with you there. to me they have seemed to do a good job of following source meterial and making good movies. Except the Mandarin. Tony actually creates Ultron in one of the stories. @highflyer I agree, but the fact is that it didn't really make a lot of money.. It would have had higher ratings had the hulk and abomination had better CGI. Even though he looked cool it was video game esk.
maninfinesuit
maninfinesuit - 8/8/2013, 9:20 AM
Iron Man 3 still made a shit ton of money. Three quarters of the people who are actually filling the seats (the GA) don't care about whether or not Mandarin was an actor, or who created Ultron.
MrReese
MrReese - 8/8/2013, 9:35 AM
I'm sure Thor will do good.
GinjaNinja
GinjaNinja - 8/8/2013, 9:57 AM
@Beto. Ant Man's hope is people are still on that Avengers High coming off of the sequel. Pretty much if they make over 500 Million on either of those movies its considered a success. On the Avengers films, over a billion is success. On the sequels like thor cap Iron man, over about 700 million is a success imho.
MoonDoggyX
MoonDoggyX - 8/8/2013, 10:31 AM
Flop, huh...

Well, So far marvel films from highest to lowest gross is:
The Avengers 1.5b 3D
Iron Man 3 1.2b 3D
Iron Man 2 623m 2D
Iron Man 1 585m 2D
Thor 449m 3D
CA:TFA 368m 3D
The Incredible Hulk 263m 2D
The Incredible Hulk did officially FLOP. Evidence of which is that we're not getting another Hulk film...

If you're gona be worried about anything, I'd worry about how the MCU will fare without Robert Downey Jr. Especially since the only Marvel Studio Films that broke the $500 mil mark have starred RDJ. Thor 2 will be the test for that. If the General audience shows up for Thor 2, then Cap 2 and GOTG will probably do well also. However, If Thor 2 doesn't make at least as Much as Iron Man 2, which wasn't even in 3d, then, I'd definitely worry about the MCU.

I agree with everyone above about Ant-Man. Avengers 2, Will be a hit though as it stars RDJ.
MoonDoggyX
MoonDoggyX - 8/8/2013, 10:48 AM
...and Iron Man 3 was an amazing film. From the opening monologue to the 70's montage ending I had a blast in this film. Almost as fun to watch as the Avengers. Like there were ever that many Mandarin fans anyway!
Minato
Minato - 8/8/2013, 10:58 AM
No
GinjaNinja
GinjaNinja - 8/8/2013, 11:35 AM
TIH had good ratings and made a profit of over 100 million. Thats not a bad flop if at all. Also ruffalo signed for 6 movies, We will probably see at least 1 more hulk film.
WYLEEJAY
WYLEEJAY - 8/8/2013, 1:03 PM
What makes a film a flop? Box office performance? Or if YOU just don't like it? Everyone (majority of people, not all of you) just can't be happy. Enjoy the damn movie.
WYLEEJAY
WYLEEJAY - 8/8/2013, 1:17 PM
And if a film flops in the box office, yet still manages to achieve a cult following ( Dredd for example) does that mean its no longer a flop? Or what if its performance doesn't impact what the general audience thinks of a film ( Avatar)? I only hear people talk crap about that movie, yet, how much money did it make? I'm so tired of hearing people say that movie was a flop, or this movie was a flop. Its all personal opinion. Just say that's what it is, instead of trying to put a label on a film, a label that it may not deserve in some peoples eyes. Sorry for the rant.
MoonDoggyX
MoonDoggyX - 8/8/2013, 4:28 PM
My definition of FLOP: Movie did not perform well enough to warrant the studio investing in a sequel to said film. I did not mean that as an insult to TIH ant all, but that is the reason why we have not yet gotten a sequel and Marvel's not even showing one in the cards at all.

The reason I said that Thor 2 will be the test is that it will show how well a Marvel Studios film can do without RDJ. I was actually thinking of this very scientifically.

Seeing as Thor had the best performing film thus far without starring RDJ and traditionally, sequel are expected to and usually do out perform their original films. Also, given the fact that Thor 2 will be released in 3D so ticket prices will be about 30% higher than normal ticket. Actually closer to 40% higher than the ticket price of Iron Man 2 if you factor in the inflation of ticket prices from 2010 and 2013. So I theorized that I would be fair to say that if thor 2 performed at least as well as IM2, it would mean that the general audience is willing to truly accept a Marvel Studio film that doesn't star RDJ. More so, that that means that there is more likely a chance that future Marvel Films not starring RDJ can achieve similar success.
WYLEEJAY
WYLEEJAY - 8/8/2013, 4:58 PM
Well said Fangz.
megabatfan
megabatfan - 8/8/2013, 5:04 PM
I think the studio will consider BO take in, plus the general audiences opinion to determine what they think of as a flop. Spider-man 3, did extremely well at the Box Office, but wasn't well received. So that's why they would consider it a flop. Because, even though it made money, they now know that general audience would be iffy towards a sequel, which would impact on the Box Office definitely. And that's what they want to stay away from ultimately. I think the same with Wolverine Origins & X-men 3. Which is why Fox probably has decided to put more efforts into their Xmen universe.
PrinceOfCrime
PrinceOfCrime - 8/9/2013, 4:51 AM
well,
TIH wasn't bad, it was cool
Iron man was good, not that great
Iron man 2 was a bad movie
Thor was not good but also not that bad, just need more asgard
CA:TFA was a very good movie, very underrated

Avengers was good ONLY because people love RDJ and Loki, that's all, they didn't care about the others

Iron Man 3 was a very bad movie to me, special FX were cool, but that's all I can talk good 'bout this movie

Thor dark world: I don't know yet but because everyone loves Loki it will get over MOS, I'm sure of that
Wallymelon
Wallymelon - 8/9/2013, 1:20 PM
anyone who talks trash on the incredible hulk is a moron. thats a solid comic book film.
Wallymelon
Wallymelon - 8/9/2013, 1:23 PM
anyone who actually liked the first cap movie is also entitled to their opinion, and its not a terrible movie. but its a bad cap movie. sooo much more drama than necessary. the first act was great after that it became a terrible film. sooo slow and boring. the action wasnt even clever. the montage was ridiculous. buckys death was done terribly, the scene where bucky gets rescued wasnt played offf well enough to where you should notice that he got probed with something.

the dialogue was sooooo weak.

Starkasm
Starkasm - 8/9/2013, 4:32 PM
Is there a reason to be worried? No, not unless you've just figured out that EVERY cbm makes changes and you've also made the realisation that you're a purist.
Lhornbk
Lhornbk - 8/9/2013, 7:50 PM
Some of you fanboys are smart enough to realize that the timing of the release of Ant-Man could kill it at the box office, but evidently aren't smart enough to realize that the exact same thing applies to Thor. Thor is not going to beat MoS, only Marvel fanboys who are blindly loyal would think otherwise. If it had been released in the summer it might have done so (for example, if it had been released at the end of July instead of Wolverine), but this November release is going to hurt it. Especially with "Hunger Games: Catching Fire" being released 2 weeks later. "Ender's Game" comes out the week before, & while I doubt it will pose much competition for Thor, it will probably hurt it a little. There is an animated movie coming out the week before, and a couple of other potentially big non-comic movies coming out as well during that time period (in particular, "The Wolf of Wall Street" with Leonardo Dicaprio that comes out the week after Thor.) Basically, Thor has 2 weeks to really pull in the money, then it's going to be seriously eclipsed. The first Hunger Games made nearly $700 million, which is about $250 million more than the first Thor movie. So "Thor: The Dark World" is probably gonna get its butt kicked. "Catching Fire" will probably beat MoS, Thor won't.

And, ummm.....since when are sequels expected to, and how many sequels actually have, done better than the original? A sequel doing better than the original is the exception, not the rule. It really only happens with the most popular franchises, and is often a result of higher ticket prices ( and with long-running franchises, it ends up often going back-and-forth, not always straight up.) The fate of the MCU does not rest with Thor, and no, it doesn't have to make over $700 million to be a success. $400-$500 million will be good enough, and that's pretty much what I predict for it.

The first Thor did better than Captain America, but I could see that reversing this time. Captain America has a better release date, and I just have a better vibe about it. As for a flop, yes that will happen eventually as Marvel tries to use C-list characters. My guess is that either GotG or Ant-Man will flop, or both. GotG will probably depend on if they get the CGI characters (these raccoon and tree characters) right. As of now, I predict Ant-Man will flop big time, will end up being Marvel's Lone Ranger/John Carter. It has a terrible release date, and quite frankly he's a dumb character, who I don't believe will be accepted be general audiences.
Liverpool4life
Liverpool4life - 8/10/2013, 11:37 AM
My numerous friends who have never read comics or did so over 20 years ago, all liked IM3. They thought the Mandarin thing was clever. I thought nothing of it. The whiners wanted this:

"The Mandarin finds the skeleton and starship of Axonn-Karr, an intelligent dragon-like alien from the planet Maklu IV, who had come to Earth centuries ago and died. Over the following years, the Mandarin studies Makluan science until he masters it. He also learns how to use the ten rings he found within the starship, which are apparently its propulsion source, among other things." (Marvel wikia)

No thank you.

My only gripe is that I wanted a few Easter eggs for the future. Unless they were there and won't be clear until the other movies come out.
MoonDoggyX
MoonDoggyX - 8/11/2013, 11:05 PM
@lhornbk - what sequels have made more than the original films???
Blade 2
Xmen 2
Spiderman 2
Pirates of tha carribean 2
Transformers 2
The Dark Knight
Iron Man 2
I mean really dude... Hardly exceptions to the rule...
MoonDoggyX
MoonDoggyX - 8/11/2013, 11:15 PM
@fangz - I said that Thor 2 needs to make as much as Iron Man 2, not 3. No way does Thor 2 need to make 1.2 billion...

Your definition of a "flop" is ridiculous. You're saying a movie can't be a flop as long as some people like it. WRONG. Spoiler alert, there's always gonna be some people that are going to like a movie. I do, however, agree that a move flopping varies depending on the expectations laid upon the film by the studio and audience response... Example: Captain America 368 mil, success... Superman Returns 391 mil, flop...
MoonDoggyX
MoonDoggyX - 8/11/2013, 11:30 PM
All I'm trying to say is that if movies not starring RDJ don start pulling in $500mil+, then Marvel/Disney may be less inclined to introduce more characters... At least on the big screen....

...and the reason I say $500mil is this. Marvel Studio films are usually budgeted at $150mil for production. Since these movies are wide releases, the price easily goes up to $225+ with distribution and advertising. The gross box office intake ratio varies depending on the studios contract with the theatre chain, also the cut from overseas box office is generally less. But, on average it comes to about 50/50 split between theatres and the studio.

Take all that intp perspevtive and Marvel Studios barely made money, if any at all on Thor 1... And they actually lost money on Cap and TIH...
GuardianDevil
GuardianDevil - 8/12/2013, 1:40 PM
IMO Thor is the worst MCU movie, but it's not horrible. TIH is sooo underrated it makes me sick. It had top notch story, action, acting, character development and villains. CGI was weak, but action was still great. Plus, it (and Iron Man1 to a lesser degree) were the only ones that didn't seem overly corny. I think ManOfReal is right, the overrated asshat called Ang Lee screwed Hulk so much people didn't care, plus TIH was overshadowed that year by Iron Man 1 as well as The Dark Knight.
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