Marvel Studios: New Details Emerge About Kevin Feige's Clash With Victoria Alonso And Why She Was Fired

@Ryguy88 - Example: Quantumania.

But not really though.

@Ryguy88 - ideology*
Idea-lol-ogy sounds fun though

@Ryguy88 - but isn't that all feige's call ? She's VFX not script .

@Seashu - very well thought out response.

I still don't know if I can get on board with the idea of ideology being the driving force behind the not so great writing/decisions.

The Endgame hand-off was extremely bad writing. It's a moment that really could have been handled so much better with some clever ideas rather than just being shoe horned in. I wouldn't disagree that it was clearly a decision made on the behalf of empowerment for women. But when people frame that as a bad thing I just don't get it. If it was a well written scene that made sense and was awesome, you probably wouldn't hear 3/4 of the criticism. But because it sticks out like a sore thumb, people automatically blame 'disneys ideology' rather than blaming the writers. I wouldn't blame ideology for it; I'd blame the writers and directors for not coming up with something smarter. All they had to do was make that scene make sense, but instead they thought it would be fine to somehow have just the women band together to do the hand-off during a giant battle where it makes no sense for the genders of characters to team up like that. The same can be said if it was an all male hand-off. It just doesn't make sense within the context of the scene. The chaos of a battle does not allow such things to exist. Unless maybe it was the Dora Milaje as they are actually a team of only women who fight alongside each other.

I get what your saying when you refer to the women characters being better at the thing the man is good at. But isn't that just a commonality of lazy writing in film, and TV? We've seen this kind of thing countless times throughout movie and tv history. Whether it's the side kick, a random bystander, a redemption for a character that was a buffoon the entire film until the end, so on and so forth. It's a lazy trap writers tend to fall into when they haven't properly thought out the approach to their story and how the characters get there. It's so common that my mind goes to those things way before it goes to the idea of woman empowerment being the problem.

Gender politics has created this cloud over the way people see things. It's such a large topic that I think even without it being the reason, people still tend to latch onto it and use it as a scapegoat as to why they don't like something. I feel like there's a confusion amongst those who call out ideology within Disney as a problem. And then there are a group that use it as a way to hide their bigotry of course, but I wouldn't suggest that is the majority.

At the end of the day I blame lazy writing attached to Marvel's progressive approach to their films. If they could just come up with better ideas, I think there would be a lot less discourse involving the gender of characters.

@Ryguy88 - why are y’all so pressed of getting capable female super heroes? It’s the same bs y’all slew for every movie. It’s just embarrassing at this point lol.

@Seashu - Many movies have the same thing with male characters already knowing and experienced in certain aspects without an explanation. No one gives them crap.

@Ryguy88 - the Gentora character was literally the worst example of this. The whole: ‘wow you’re awesome….’ breakout sequence was so hamfistedly trying too hard that it was painful to watch

@Ryguy88 - How did she get all of those added if she is over VFX?

@Ryguy88 - my forever thoughts: