A Pointless Debate: Man of Steel

@Scorpion8125

I actually loved the film, but even I have my problems with it. I'm glad your mature enough to admit what you did and didn't like about it, though.

I actually have faith in the casting decisions. I never judge actors by their pasts, which is why I didn't even blink when I heard Chris Evans was Captain America. I think Ben will be a great Batman and Jesse will give us a psychologically layered Luthor. Based on what I know about Gal Gadot as Wonder Woman, I'm drawing from what I researched about Henry before he was Superman. Henry in real life is, in regards to personality and attitude (polite, gentle, charitable, upstanding, etc.), very Superman-like. Same thing with Gal and Wonder Woman, as she has a strong opinion of women overall and said a speech a while back that made me believe she could be Wonder Woman.

Thanks for the compliment on my article by the way.

@BruceWillis

Do you even get the point of my article? It's meant to tell the people who hate the movie and constantly complain about it to irrationally high levels that their opinion holds no bearing. This isn't for reasonable people who like to debate and argue just for the heck of it. It's for people who feel the needs to go overboard with it and give others flack for liking a film they do not.

To be honest, I am tired of this debate and I wrote this article because I can't have one decent conversation about MOS, a movie I love, without someone I don't even know coming out of nowhere and criticizing the heck out of it just to annoy me and the person/friend I am debating with. It happens to me in real life, too. Just yesterday, a friend and I were discussing MOS and this guy we worked with came out of nowhere and annoyed us by roasting on the film.

Again, the point of my article wasn't meant to address the problems people have with it. It's to tell those who have overexpressed problems with it that their opinions mean nothing in the long run and should just develop the maturity and will to back off and simply not engage in the debate if it's going to get them riled up. No amount of disdain will change anything about MOS or it's future.

To be honest, it is somewhat sad that people think just because they are fans of certain characters that they think they should have a say in who is cast in what role. That is not how it works. They cast based on the needs of the story, not the demands of the fans. Most fans don't have experience in the world of film to make the business choice of selecting an actor for a role. It's a much more difficult and tough business decision than people seem to think.

@Jojuliz88 - "I personally hated MOS. Snyder's superman had no heart or soul."

He learned at a young age he was an alien sent to live on a foreign planet, but despite his superpowers he was very weak emotional. There was literally no one who could relate to what he was he was experiencing/going through, despite the Kent's doing the best could or knew how. Not to mention, he felt an empty void not knowing who he really was and what his purpose was with these superpowers. There's plenty of reasons and plenty of things that happened to Clark that could've caused him to be evil or "abuse" his powers.
(the bar scene with Clark destroying the bully's truck comes to mind. Personally I love the scene. It conveys the heavy burden Clark carries with hiding who he really is and from having superpowers. Considering what he did to the truck, Clark was clearly affected by the bully. However, it did a solid job of showing Clark's restraint. Clark could've simply used his powers or strength (without anyone suspecting it) to physically attack/hurt the bully or he could've humiliated the bully more than he humiliated Clark. But Clark didn't. And I think it served as an homage to Superman 2 with Clark and the diner bully. Except, MoS handled its bully EXPONENTIALLY better. In Superman 2, now that Clark has his powers back, he uses them to both physically attack/hurt the bully and he humiliated the bully in front of several diner customers and employees. So, not only did Clark possibly expose his superpowers/strength in front of multiple bystanders, he used said powers/strength to assault a human, bully or not. And on top of it all he destroyed the diner's pinball machine! hahaha.)
Anyway, when Clark leaves the bar, he continues his soul searching quest. After Kal meets Jor-El and FINALLY accomplishes his goal of learning who he really is & begins to understand his purpose on Earth. And THIS is when we see ALL the heart and soul!! I've watched MoS plenty of times and I still get chills when Clark first learns to fly and we see him smile. Clark no longer has that void in his life and some of the heavy burden he's long carried feels lifted. And he can f*cking fly! So much heart, soul and emotion in that scene alone.

"It felt like the movie handcock."

Fun fact: Vince Gilligan wrote Hancock. Gilligan butted heads with Will Smith & Smith's personal writers. After doing a dozen re-writes Gilligan got frustrated with Smith & Hancock director Peter Berg. So, Gilligan quit Hancock to begin pre-production for season one of a show he created called Breaking Bad. It's an interesting story, but it's entirely why I was/am concerned with Will Smith being part of Suicide Squad's ensemble cast.
http://uproxx.com/tv/2013/09/vince-gilliganhancockpeter-berg/

"Snyder ripped off a lot of character designs from other movies. Its ok to be a little inspired but he definitely coppied a lot from the matrix and avatar!!!"

Can you elaborate more about how exactly Snyder "ripped off" character designs?? And what did he copy from the Matrix & Avatar?? And I'm sorry, but I think it's hilarious that of all movies to accuse a director/movie of copying you say Avatar. I mean Avatar is one of the most common/popular movies accused of copying themes/story from other films! The most obvious/common of those films being Ferngully and Dances with Wolves. Not to mention, Avatar arguably used the most cliche/troupes of all-time. hahaha

"Superman should have the heart of captain America."

I like to believe the idea MoS is the birth of Superman. Superpowers and a costume does not a superhero/Superman make. Meaning, this is very much an origin story with Clark understanding his purpose and deciding to publicly use his powers for good. But this was over a short period of time. I'm not sure I consider Clark a superhero or even "Superman" because it's about showing the heavy burden and all that becoming a superhero entails. From another perspective, this is an origin story and the first film of the DCEU. So, I thought it was a brilliant decision to allow and show the opportunity for character development & growth. You risk making the character one-dimensional if he's the "Golden Boy" superhero and the ideal Superman in MoS because how can/does the character grow and evolve from "perfect"???

"Now bvs looks like green lantern all over again! Souless action set pieces"

Care to explain how it looks like Green Lantern??? Do you know who Chris Terrio is or are you familiar with his work?? If you did, I'm not sure how you'd think this film will be "soulless." If anything, you could at least be optimistic Terrio improved the story/dialogue. Maybe it's me, but it's seems like a good indication that Terrio did something right/good, since WB/DC hired him to write the Justice League movies before BvS is released. I mean if there was any doubt you'd think WB/DC would wait to see how audiences/critics respond to BvS before hiring Terrio to write what will the DCEU's biggest films to date, ya know??

I hope all that made sense. I need to not smoke/drink when I get on here bc I end up being a tad verbose and rambling a little too much. I mean it makes sense to me, just not always sure it makes sense to others. haha. Plus, considering how much I wrote, it's obviously something I like and want to discuss, but I don't mean for my intoxication to negatively effect the discussion.

i enjoyed it, it was good but not great the biggest problem i had was jonathan kent and how he was handled, i was also surprised zack snyder didnt do at least 1 slo-mo scene

It is time you moved on and got over this film.

I generally agree, but it is kind of hard to do. It was one of my most expected CBMs ever, and seeing how it's the foundation for the first ever connected DC universe on the big screen which really kicks off next year with a direct MOS sequel... well, it's not actually all that easy a topic to avoid. :(

1) The Majority of the Audience Loved It

It was a generally "ok" reaction. It wasn't loved in the same way that films like Avengers or The Dark Knight were. People didn't hate it or love it. And I'm talking about the casual audience not the comic book crowd.

Remember that only a select type of people will put their input on this website. They don't represent the "majority" of the general audience in any way whatsoever. We have no reference for who these people even are.


2) It was a Box Office Smash-Hit

Well it certainly was a success and wasn't a flop by any means. But the mixed reception clearly had an effect on box office numbers. There was an incredible amount of hype for the film, and the trailers had more views than that of Ironman 3.

Yet it's sales weren't as good as what they could have been. And that's probably because of 2 things;

- negative/mixed reviews

- word of mouth (yea, the film was ok I guess)

It just didn't catch on to the general audience as much as it could have. Considering this is a Superman film, the most iconic character in our culture today. Who is now re-invented as this cool, serious and action packed character.

Hell, the first spiderman movie made a lot more back in 2002. And that was long before the "cbm craze".


3)It is Moving Forward

That's true. A lot of that is because of the success of the MCU and a desire for WB to create their own cinematic universe. I'm not saying that's bad or anything, but that's definitely true.

@CrappyNappy

Also, I'm glad they decided on a shared universe. They can't keep relying on Superman and Batman to bring in success. Not to mention, other popular heroes are long overdue for some big-screen exposure: Wonder Woman, Aquaman, etc.

many people ( mainly insecure disney\marvel trolls) perpetuated and tried hard to spread negativity about man of steel without seeing a damn thing. thankfully the general audience didnt buy into that bullshit and it went on to do well. Bvs will really emphasise the birth of the dc universe and im looking forward to it.

@Shield23

They really start talking about MOS in that video around 9 min, 30 sec

@Shield23
@EricBorder
@DrKinsolving

@MrPagBrewster

The DCEU isn't being rushed. MOS set up the DCEU extremely well. It makes sense to have Batman (Bruce Wayne), Wonder Woman (Diana Prince), Barry Allen, Aquaman, etc, show up in the DCEU's second outing, because we will be able to see how they react and how the world reacted to the Black Zero event.

Also, the month after the Man of Steel sequel was green lit, Snyder announced that the movie would include Batman at Comic Con. As far as we know, this could have easily been the plan all along. Plus, the Bertron's Curse/Doomsday/Zod connection, etc, etc.... Snyder has even called Batman v Superman: Dawn of Justice more of a MOS sequel than anything because it directly follows the events of Man of Steel.

meant cap3

This film rustles so many jimmies which is one of the many reasons why its amazing.