DOCTOR WHO: "The Giggle" Leak Reveals Shocking Plan For David Tennant & Ncuti Gatwa's Regeneration - SPOILERS

DOCTOR WHO: "The Giggle" Leak Reveals Shocking Plan For David Tennant & Ncuti Gatwa's Regeneration - SPOILERS

New details about this Saturday's final Doctor Who 60th anniversary episode, "The Giggle," have been revealed and Russell T Davies appears to have a downright bonkers plan for the next regeneration...

By JoshWilding - Dec 04, 2023 05:12 PM EST
Filed Under: Doctor Who
Source: SFFGazette.com

We've now two-thirds of the way into Doctor Who's 60th-anniversary specials, but the next - titled "The Giggle" - will be the big one. So far, Donna's mind has been saved and she and the Fourteenth Doctor - who looks exactly like the Tenth, for some reason - have embarked on another adventure together in outer space. 

Next up is a clash with Neil Patrick Harris' Celestial Toymaker, and regardless of how it plays out, we know it will end with the hero's regenerating into Ncuti Gawta's fifteenth iteration of the Time Lord. Or will it?

Spoilers that were posted before any of the specials aired have resurfaced today (via SFFGazette.com) and, with the descriptions of "The Star Beast" and "Wild Blue Yonder" proven correct, it's safe to assume the breakdown of "The Giggle" is as well. As a result, we now know there's a game-changing twist coming which sets the stage for not one, but two Doctors moving forward. 

Here's the leak in its entirety (apologies for the grammatical errors, but we're sharing it in its original form). 

"The Toymaker says he has played one game with a previous doctor, the second with the Fourteenth now he must play with a next doctor. As the Fourteenth regenerates he finds he hasn’t changed but there is the Fifteenth Doctor next to him, this is where the 'What the hell is going on here' is said. Later they both in unison say 'I challenge you to a game!' the Toymaker annoyed says 'That’s cheating, there is 2 of you!' and Fourteen says 'But according to the rules you can’t say no.' he accepts the challenge."

"Together, they manage to win the game and The Fourteenth’s prize was to banish The Toymaker from existence. After the game, the Fourteenth Doctor, the Fifteenth Doctor, Donna, and Mel discuss the consequences of their adventures mentioning Sarah Jane, Adric, River Song. Donna tells the Doctors why don’t they just take a break and enjoy the simpler life. That’s when the Fifteenth Doctor remembers he hasn’t said what his prize would be. A second TARDIS! Now the Fourteenth Doctor stays behind while the Fifteenth flies off in his TARDIS."

There's no doubt a fair bit of information missing here, but the gist is that we are indeed getting a "bi-regeneration," resulting in the Doctor splitting in two rather than leaving his old self behind. We have to believe this will lead to a spin-off revolving around David Tennant's Fourteenth Doctor, though some fans aren't happy with the decision. 

They believe it makes Gatwa's Fifteenth Doctor little more than a "clone" and a stand-in for the real deal. That's not exactly fair when he'll be established as the Fifteenth Doctor; plus, we still don't know why this happens or what led to the Tenth Doctor's face returning (suggesting there's a much bigger story in the works). 

Doctor Who showrunner Russell T Davies is likely playing the long game so we'll have to wait and see. This does, however, lay the groundwork for some very exciting future stories. Let us know your thoughts in the comments section. 

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Batmangina
Batmangina - 12/4/2023, 5:07 PM
They still make Doctor WHO? 🤷‍♂️
HashTagSwagg
HashTagSwagg - 12/4/2023, 5:14 PM
@Batmangina - UK tax payers are forced to pay for the BBC so the show can keep going longer than most shows.
Scarilian
Scarilian - 12/4/2023, 5:18 PM
@HashTagSwagg -
Recently the BBC entered into a contractual deal with Disney, which is partially why it's went full propaganda at this point with the scripts just re-using elements of prior story-lines.

Heck, the bi-regeneration being described is just the meta-crisis regeneration all over again with Tennant's incarnation yet again - one version continues to be the Doctor with a new face while the other lives a normal life on Earth.

Disney have contracted the show for five years (2023, 2024, 2025, 2026, 2027) so we'll be stuck with this show being worn like a flesh puppet spewing controversial takes that those involved don't even understand for the next four years.
Batmangina
Batmangina - 12/4/2023, 5:29 PM
@HashTagSwagg - That's a goddamn tragedy. Is it just the social outcasts and weirdos just getting revenge on the last slice of culture (the genre nerds) that had a thing that wasn't 'Inclusive' enough?

I can't imagine a longtime, genuine fan of ANY iconic pop culture IP being so intent on making it lame and gay EVERY SINGLE TIME across the board.
dagenspear
dagenspear - 12/4/2023, 6:11 PM
@Scarilian - Disney doesn't even do propaganda with it's Marvel and Star Wars products like that. Why would it happen with this and it not just be RTD doing whatever?
dagenspear
dagenspear - 12/4/2023, 6:12 PM
@Batmangina - Clearly it's not because no main character in Star Wars or the MCU has been developed to be gay.
Feralwookiee
Feralwookiee - 12/4/2023, 6:55 PM
@dagenspear - *ahem*

dagenspear
dagenspear - 12/4/2023, 7:08 PM
@Feralwookiee - Not developed in the movies.
Feralwookiee
Feralwookiee - 12/4/2023, 7:12 PM
@dagenspear - This was a joke.

Remember jokes?
Batmangina
Batmangina - 12/4/2023, 7:40 PM
@dagenspear - Nobody gives a [frick]. The forcefed DEI bullshit is leading to the box office demise and ultimate disappearance of all this cuck ass shoehorning to appeal to the low single digit population that this matters to - it's all dying on the vine.

Today's companies can tread the inclusivity high road all the way to bankruptcy court.

Nobody wants this dumbass reinvented content.

Judas Priest is one of my favorite bands and I COULD NOT CARE LESS if the singer [frick]s 100 guys a week.
dagenspear
dagenspear - 12/4/2023, 7:53 PM
@Batmangina - Forced in what? There's no gay main characters in Star Wars or MCU. How can it be forced if it's not there?
dagenspear
dagenspear - 12/4/2023, 7:54 PM
@Feralwookiee - I only responded with it not being in the movies.
Batmangina
Batmangina - 12/4/2023, 8:01 PM
@dagenspear - I could have sworn this was a Doctor WHO article when I walked in.

Star Wars is already and there is no bringing it back.

Next.
dagenspear
dagenspear - 12/4/2023, 8:48 PM
@Batmangina - You were talking about social outcasts getting revenge on genre nerds, not me.

It hasn't because there's no developed gay characters in Star Wars at all.
Batmangina
Batmangina - 12/4/2023, 9:33 PM
@dagenspear - Did they retcon out the retcon where LANDO was space gay?

I thought he was a pangalactic gargleblaster that would [frick] anything now because that was how Billy Dee would roll in today's Galaxy Far, Far Away...?
Scarilian
Scarilian - 12/4/2023, 10:28 PM
@dagenspear -
It's a lot of factor. I do believe RTD is a huge factor, however Moffat and Chibnall also had the same mindset along with the BBC, Governments, Disney, etc...

Sadly, it's going to be in everything soon enough. The mindset of the insane.

Originally the world had a mindset of 'Learn from the mistakes of the past' however those currently in positions of power have two mindsets 'Let the past die/forget the past' OR 'Make the past into what we wish it was'. The idea is that if you destroy the past or reshape it you can manipulate the present to create a desired future. People are less likely to fight for a past that is no longer remembered or has been warped.

One of the key examples of this is media depicting the past as being diverse and multicultural, a method of trying to erase and ignore the struggles of society and to pretend that there has never been any issues caused by different groups mixing throughout time. In this episode they did that with Isaac Newton.

Rather than acknowledge the flaws of the past in order to learn from them, we are presented with media claiming the flaws never existed or simply that the past itself never existed/should be forgotten.
dagenspear
dagenspear - 12/5/2023, 12:51 AM
@Batmangina - As far as I saw in the movies it never existed.

Most we got there was Lando may have been into a robot. Weird? I think so. Gay? Not there.
dagenspear
dagenspear - 12/5/2023, 8:26 AM
@Batmangina - Is that developed in the movies? If not, it shows my point. Some of you getting hung up on things that don't even exist in the movies and are only talked about outside of it.
Batmangina
Batmangina - 12/5/2023, 9:08 AM
@dagenspear - I'm well aware of your point - the 'Only the Movies Are Canon' thing used to work and it can serve to keep you on the uncancelled side of the argument and seen as 'an ally' but it doesn't stop the Hell in a Handbasket trajectory.

Star Wars is a Girl Brand now and Rey is the New Disney Princess writ large - those movies are [frick]ing awful whether Lando is off bouncing bantha balls on his chin or not.
DubCheezy
DubCheezy - 12/5/2023, 12:20 PM
@Scarilian - The 60th specials were written before the Disney Deal was finalized so anything that is considered "woke propaganda" in the specials are all BBC and Davies. But let's be honest, Doctor Who has been "Woke" for a very long time, some might argue since it's inception. The previous Doctor Jodie Whittaker's run was heavily criticized for being too "woke."
Scarilian
Scarilian - 12/5/2023, 1:41 PM
@DubCheezy -
Having an element of politics/social commentary is not a problem, most Sci-Fi uses these aspects to connect futuristic scenarios to our understanding of reality. Sci-Fi normally presents a scenario and allows you time to ponder it which enables you to think through and decide your own viewpoint.

Some of the best episodes of Doctor Who have heavy political and social themes that are presented in a well written nuanced way.

The trouble is it went from presenting common political or social concerns to extremely divisive topics and then proceeded to straight-up lecture you on how to think/feel.

RTD revived Doctor Who with a central yet left-leaning viewpoint but the views were what a majority of the UK population had at the time.

• Eccleston/Tennant Era kept it quite simple by just going with overall concerns of the British population at the time - governments/politicians bad, nuclear power plants dangerous, pollution bad, drugs bad, government agencies unregulated/corrupted, TV addiction, Slavery bad, etc...

• Smith Era it introduced a little more focus on the female companions but again it was stuff most people would agree on - hunting bad, drilling could be dangerous, etc...

• Capaldi Era is where it started to become heavily political and divisive. You'd have an episode about abortion, climate change, capitalism, immigration - written by people who had no idea how to tell a nuanced story and were not capable of handling the story-lines well. You also started to get revisionist history where the past was being diversified for the sake of portraying an idealized world that frankly risks making people forget the lessons learned.

• Jodie Era was where it just became propaganda - The Doctor is female and maybe a lesbian, The 1st Doctor is now a little black girl, racism, sexism, colonization, religious intolerance.

• Tennant Era 2 is now just propaganda. Mocking the Doctor for being Male-presenting, telling him to respect pronouns, having it reaffirmed constantly that a trans character is 'beautiful' over and over as if to reinforce the idea, a segment about dead naming of trans people, having the episode itself mislabel the trans person as a solution of the episode because the writing is shit. Having the Doctor visit a race swapped Isaac Newton, having the Doctor and Donna question the pronouns of a dead alien, reinforcing storylines that they know fans hated such as Timeless Child (Made to diversify the Doctor) and Flux
Scarilian
Scarilian - 12/4/2023, 5:15 PM
Only reason the show is still being made is because they can use it as a method of revisionist history and propaganda that even the creators don't actually believe as shown by the contradictions.

They lost 250,000 overnight viewers between The Star Beast and Wild Blue Yonder. We're now in the 4m viewers level which puts it on par with Season 12. The drops will continue because each episode is choosing to take a stance with something controversial or divisive.

It'll wind up something they air on TV out of contractual obligation as opposed to being because anyone watches it. Four years of that and then perhaps it'll have the dignity of being allowed to die.
Apophis71
Apophis71 - 12/5/2023, 8:01 AM
@Scarilian - Full numbers now in for viewing in the UK of the first episode

7.6M viewers (inc HD) highest figures for any drama all year and accounts for over 11% of the total UK population

Second highest drama of the week was Shetland at 5.6M viewers
Third highest drama Coronation Street which peaked below 4.8M viewers during the week

As previously stated, for BBC it landed and has retained the second highest viewing figures for both episodes behind only Strictly Come Dancing. Only other show with higher viewing figures higher in the UK on it's first week was I'm a Celebrity on ITV (only runs for two weeks) which like Strictly always is their highest viewing figures when on.

Big dips in UK shows in early numbers (ie Just on broadcast not including digital) not uncommon when you have free catchup available for everyone over here depending on what else is on live, not all of which would be available on catchup and/or that you would always want to watch live when possible like Football (Soccer).

Live viewing figures have declined year on year ever since streaming, and esp iplayer, has become a thing so comparing number to prior years is always flawed spin. Always need to compare to market of the time not back before the fairly recent expansion of the broadband/fibre network to the point now where nearly all in Britain have access and devices able to provide fast internat and stream iplayer for free wherever and whenever they choose to.

In short, stick to opinions of the show and your personal issues with them and stop trying to spin numbers you obviously don't understand to make what is considered by those numbers a huge hit as being reflective of anything as kinda counters your valid negative opinions of the series even if I tend to disagree with those opinions in the main.

Now, if you wanna show what US drama had over 11% of the American population watching within the first seven days of release this year have at it, can't recall reporting on any with over 37M viewers myself but...

...if they exist could be interesting to compare :D
Scarilian
Scarilian - 12/5/2023, 11:19 AM
@Apophis71 -
"accounts for over 11% of the total UK population"

Consolidated figures don't work like that. It just means it was watched 7.61m overall times.

We know 5.08m are unique screens due to the overnight viewership because it's judging a single time viewership.

For the consolidated it is judging all showings including the overnight over the course of 7 days, including repeats on TV and/or watching online.

Due to this consolidated viewing figures are not free from overlap, such as the same individual watching it multiple times over the course of 7 days. Every single viewership counts towards that 7.61m tally.

The massive gap between overnight and consolidated is abnormal, normally it is between 1-2m which has been roughly consistent throughout the revived era. The largest gap it's had was a one-off 2.3m so a gap of 2.53m seems suspect personally.

Either way, we've seen a 250,000 drop-off in overnight viewership. If the consolidated for Special 2 which we'll get next week has the same or more drop-off then they've lost viewers.
Apophis71
Apophis71 - 12/5/2023, 11:27 AM
@Scarilian - If it did dip it did, but that total would still be considered a huge hit in the current market where anything over 4million viewers is huge and rare for any drama other than Coronation Street and Emmerdale. Even the Beebs biggest ongoing soap, Eastenders doesn't oft go above 4m.
Apophis71
Apophis71 - 12/5/2023, 11:37 AM
@Scarilian - btw, overlap is normaly minimised in consolidated UK figures due to iplayer accounts connected to physical home address/TV licences. If anything outside of the Ipsos MORI surveys included which I would expect takes longer to take account of they could under account for figures of indivual people watchin due to not accounting fully how many are sat together watching on the same screen at any given time but...
Scarilian
Scarilian - 12/5/2023, 11:43 AM
@Apophis71 -
Doctor Who is not comparable to those. It's an entirely different genre. You are comparing a sci-fi action adventure show with slice of life storylines about towns/villages.

Coronation Street and Emmerdale also have a much lower average budget per episode:

• Episodes of Coronation Street cost 250,000 each
• Episodes of Emmerdale costs £125,000 each
• Episodes of Doctor Who cost £1-£3 million each

For the amount of money spent on Doctor Who it should be doing several magnitudes better than Coronation Street and Emmerdale.
Apophis71
Apophis71 - 12/5/2023, 11:56 AM
@Scarilian - And? Dr Who viewing for these specials has biggest numbers for anything fiction based be they action, crime, thriller, scifi, comedy thus larger viewing figures than ANY drama in the UK all year including those with a bigger budget than Dr Who. What else is it supposed to be compared to? A Royal Wedding or world cup final?
Scarilian
Scarilian - 12/5/2023, 1:11 PM
@Apophis71 -
I mean, if you intend to do a comparison, then Doctor Who should be raking in a minimum of around 4x to 10x the viewership of Coronation Street/Emmerdale respectively given the cost. Otherwise what's the point in spending a minimum of 4x to 10x the budget to make a Doctor Who episode.

Also, we need to acknowledge this is the 60th anniversary with the most popular Doctor, the most popular cast, the most popular composer, the most popular writers/directors and a massively increased budget.

It shouldn't be struggling on viewership this much already and if it's struggling now it's going to be amplified when it comes to the later episodes and eventually the Ncuti era.
Apophis71
Apophis71 - 12/5/2023, 1:32 PM
@Scarilian - Dr Who sells better globaly than Corrie/Emmerdale so exactly the same as other multimillion budget UK drama from The Met, Vigil, Shetland, Prime Suspect all with huge budgets at least as big or bigger than Dr Who but lower domestic viewing fiures.

How they have been able to keep going with stuff like that against the multiple times bigger budgets for American shows and stuff on Netflix/Amazon.

Peaky Blinders had a bigger budget than Dr Who at the time but to get the sort of money needed for that sort of drama's they made a deal with Netflix. Average cost for an episode of a drama on TV these days is about £6,000,000 per epsisode if not more. In comparison Dr Who has always been considered one of the best value, lowest budget drama shows outside of soaps like Corrie and certainly the cheapest mainstream scifi one.

Again however the highest viewing figures for any drama shown on live TV in the UK of any genre is NOT under any math struggling on viewership.
Scarilian
Scarilian - 12/5/2023, 2:01 PM
@Apophis71 -
Several of the shows you mentioned had substantially higher viewership than Doctor Who at the time they aired and a few are due a new series this year.

Vigil, whose consolidated never dropped below 8.8m, is getting a season 2 in a week. The first episode of Season 2 airs this Sunday and we'll have consolidated viewership late December.

You seem to be ignoring all of the factors that contributed to the first episode of Doctor Who this year having high viewership which I mentioned prior.

We've seen a drop off of 250,000 for the overnight and I doubt that the consolidated will make-up for that drop.

As for your remark, Doctor Who had a budget increase in the Moffat Era and again recently with the Disney deal. It's not a low budget show anymore.
Apophis71
Apophis71 - 12/5/2023, 2:19 PM
@Scarilian - The numbers are sill considered very high regardless, highest for the show since a New Year special over 4yrs ago, thus above expectations not below.
Apophis71
Apophis71 - 12/5/2023, 2:52 PM
@Scarilian - We will see with Vigil as it was a HUGE unexpected hit last series a tad unknown this year without having it based around a nuclear sub anymore and more your standard crime drama...

...but Dr Who this year had a lower budget still and bigger viewing figures than The Met and Shetland this year. As to Peaky Blinders with a bigger budget thanks to the netflix deal the viewing figures for the final season last year started out on a consolodated UK viewing of 6.5M and the final episode 7.2M. The UK Prime suspect hasn't been on for a long time however, about 10yrs back tbh dunno why I included it (was thinking of another show of that ILK that was on earlier year UK based and got the names mixed up).


As I say, anything over 4m in the current market in the UK is considered a hit and the bigger budget was still WAY WAY below average, even UK non-soap drama show average, before the Disney deal and still gonna be a fractiion of the budgets for all their D+ Star Wars and Marvel shows going forward.

It is completely fine to hate the show, but to try and paint it as anything other than a hit in the UK is simply false.
Scarilian
Scarilian - 12/5/2023, 10:53 PM
@Apophis71 -
"Dr Who this year had a lower budget still and bigger viewing figures than The Met and Shetland this year."

You keep claiming this but neither has budget officially stated anywhere while Doctor Who was stated as having a much larger budget this year.

Apophis71
Apophis71 - 12/6/2023, 6:52 AM
@Scarilian - Your the one that brought costs into it as if it were a factor at all for what is considered a hit or not, when it isn't at all and never has been for UK TV. Budget is only about cost/benefit ratios and funding/profit considerations nothing more.

However the cost of drama's compared compared to those with still good viewing figures of far cheaper shows like quiz shows, reality TV type stuff, long running soaps and all that is why the amount of original UK dramas made by BBC and ITV has reduced compared to back before streaming. Your never going to have the BBC supporting a £15m per episode budget for the likes of Game of Thrones or Book of Bobba Fett, £25m/ep for the likes of WV Loki FatWS and certainly never £58M/ep for LotR rings of Power. They do have to compete to a degree with those now to slow the decline in traditional TV viewing figures to justify the continuation of the TV licence and such like so the calculation has tended to be 1 to 3 million for original dramas and major natural history productions was worth it for the long term health of the domestic industry and if they need/want a bigger budget show go into co-production with American companies and or gain it through selling rights for exclusive foreign distribution to streaming platforms.

As for if the D+ budget has kicked in yet which I don't think it has till the 15th starts his show then if that budget is worth it is more a question for Disney viewing figures and costs to that company not to the TV licence payers. The Beeb will likely still have an estimated average cost of around £1.5m per episode it has had since they upped it during the Moffat era which equates to around 20p per viewer for that first special viewing figures.
Scarilian
Scarilian - 12/6/2023, 3:19 PM
@Apophis71 -
I'm asking for your source on the budget for any of the shows you mentioned.
Apophis71
Apophis71 - 12/6/2023, 3:55 PM
@Scarilian - Do your own research, the state of the industy and costs of shows is discussed a lot whenever the government is reviewing stuff on news reports and documentaries in regard to the future of TV and the licence fee/advertising revenue and such like but numbers are oft vague and rarely precisely stated in websites.

Reason they upped the budget under Moffat was it had long been one of the lowest of all budgets for drama's outside of the long running soaps but was selling well enough in oversea markets considering said cost and even if/when dipping retaining high end UK viewing figures dropping slower than the industry average over here for broadcast TV, ie increased investment was viewed as worth the money for that and general value of the Beeb considerations with the recurring licence fee/funding debates.

All irrelevant to the measure of if a show is a hit or not specificaly on UK viewing figures, only comes into consideration if when channels are considering where to invest and where to make cuts and tbh if Disney loose money on their investment don't realy care and nothing outside the norm these days for them it seems :D.
Scarilian
Scarilian - 12/7/2023, 2:05 AM
@Apophis71 -
"Do your own research"

I have and the only sources are that it's not disclosed. Your entire new argument depends on the budgets being equal or higher and I'm seeing no source to justify that position.


"All irrelevant to the measure of if a show is a hit or not specificaly on UK viewing figures"

BBC, despite the poor handling, don't want the Doctor Who brand too damaged. If the viewership is low enough, they'll cancel it.
Apophis71
Apophis71 - 12/7/2023, 2:37 AM
@Scarilian - As I say, cost/benefit is only time funding is a consideration not in direct correlation regarding production cost ratio to viewership...

...and it was entirely you who brought money into it putting forth the believed but not confirmed production costs of the show yet expect me to come up with exacting figures cos you moved the goalposts?

Yeh anything considered failing is always going to be at risk of being cancelled, though with BBC things oft are not as straight forward as they are for standard market forces equations in decision making, and any budget will be oft reviewed. However best viewing numbers of any drama all year their will currently be zero concern over low viewership as the viewership is very high by UK standards and highest it has been for over 4yrs.

NON of any 'argument' I had was ANYTHING to do with budget, you brought that into it AND ut forth a figure for the Dr Who and soaps budgets. My only argument in all of this is the viewing figures are NOT low, they are VERY high, highest for any drama all year period and additionaly even during Jodie's run, which certainly had maor issues with it in a number of ways, viewing nmbers were dropping slower than the average for broadcast TV.
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