JUSTICE LEAGUE Director Zack Snyder Explains The Importance Of Batman And The Joker Meeting In The Movie

JUSTICE LEAGUE Director Zack Snyder Explains The Importance Of Batman And The Joker Meeting In The Movie

Zack Snyder's Justice League will see Ben Affleck's Batman finally cross paths with Jared Leto's Joker, and the filmmaker has now explained why it was important to have that happen in the "Snyder Cut."

By JoshWilding - Feb 18, 2021 02:02 AM EST
Filed Under: Justice League
Source: I Minutemen

Zack Snyder's Justice League hits HBO Max on March 18th, and while we have a lot of reasons to be excited, one of the biggest has to be seeing Ben Affleck's Batman come face-to-face with Jared Leto's Joker. We know these long-time enemies will cross paths in the "Knightmare" future where Darkseid has taken over the Earth, and the Caped Crusader is fighting to save the planet. 

We don't know what their meeting will entail (it could just as easily be a team-up as a fight to the death), but this is something fans have hoped to see since Batman v Superman: Dawn of Justice.

During a recent interview with I Minutemen, Snyder explained why bringing back Leto as the Clown Prince of Crime was a priority for him, and the importance of having these two characters meet. 

"It was important to me that Batman and Joker have a scene together. Let's be honest, Batman/Joker are kind of the - that conflict is central to the universe," the filmmaker explains. "Frankly, it was a conflict that I had planned for the Knightmare sequence. And so, you know [I] was excited to like, get the opportunity to do it, to have a little taste [of] that. So, I thought it was important for fans to see their Batman and this cinematic universe's Joker coming to some small conflict."

It's thought the scene will only be a few minutes long, and in an ideal world, Snyder no doubt hoped to delve into this clash in his planned Justice League sequel. Unfortunately, that's unlikely to happen, but at least we know we'll get a taste of it in the "Snyder Cut" of the DC Comics adaptation. 

What are you hoping to see from Batman and The Joker's first meeting in the SnyderVerse?


Click on the "Next" button below to check out some
details about Darren Aronofsky's Batman: Year One!

10. A Massively Different Take On Catwoman

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cBatman's had many a love interest over the years, but Selina Kyle remains the most iconic. That dynamic will be explored by Matt Reeves in The Batman, and Aronofsky had similar plans.

Well, kinda. 

In Year One, Selina was to be depicted as a prostitute and dominatrix who works under the name Mistress Selina. Depicted as an African-American woman, she was to be one of the first people Batman saved. However, the script depicts her knocking the hero out, and leaving him next to the dead body of the corrupt cop who'd been beating her before the vigilante intervened.

Inspired by Batman, Selina later dons her own costume, and soon grows close to the man who once saved her. 
 

9. Homeless Bruce Wayne

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In the comics, Bruce Wayne's parents are gunned down in front of him, leaving the family butler, Alfred Pennyworth, to raise the boy. 

There was no Alfred in Aronofsky's plans, however, and poor Bruce would have been left penniless and homeless in the wake of Thomas and Martha Wayne's brutal murder. With no fortune at his disposal, Bruce's dynamic was massively different in this film, as was his transformation into Batman. 

Everyone knows the Dark Knight's origin story, so Aronofsky deserves some kudos for trying to shake things up. 

Bruce wouldn't stay on the streets for long, however, as he'd find a new mentor in car repair shop owner, Little Al...
 

8. "Little Al," Batman's New Mentor

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Before being inspired to fight crime by his encounter with Mistress Selina, Bruce would have crossed paths with Little Al. 

The owner of a car repair shop, he'd have taken the orphan under his wing, and was set to be portrayed by an African-American actor. Bruce becomes well-versed in mechanics, and it's with Al's help that he manages to build the Batmobile. 

A Lincoln Continental, this "Batmobile" had an exposed school bus engine, and doesn't sound that different from the vehicle we'll see in The Batman next year. 

Al was obviously meant to be a surrogate for Alfred, and while he didn't have any fighting experience, he clearly helped this Bruce come up with his weaponry and vehicle. 
 

7. Learning To Fight

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With no fortune to lean back on, Bruce Wayne obviously could travel the world to hone his skills. 

He's an orphan taken under the wing of a working class mechanic, so heading overseas to be trained by the likes of Ra's al Ghul was understandably not part of this screenplay for Year One

Instead, Bruce read books about combat, learning from those, and practising for hours afterwards. We're not entirely sure that's the best way to become an expert fighter, but Aronofsky was clearly determined to ground this story in reality, and make Batman a self-made vigilante. 

By now, we know why Bruce becomes Batman, but the how is another story altogether. 
 

6. The Birth Of The Bat-Man

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The brothel Mistress Selina worked in was not only within Bruce's eyeline from his home with Little Al, but also based in the now dilapidated theater he visited with his parents before their murder.

Inspired to now protect his home, Bruce finally opens the one thing his father left him: a silver signet ring in an envelope with the initials "T.W." on it.

Beating up a criminal, that ring leaves a mark which looks a little like a bat on the crook's face, earning the vigilant the "Bat-Man" moniker. Like his comic book counterpart, he dons a costume in an effort to strike fear into those who target the innocents in Gotham City. 

As weird as this film sometimes gets, this sounds like a pretty decent origin story!
 

5. Extreme Violence

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If what we've told you about Year One reminds you of anything, it should be 2019's Joker. 

Tonally, it sounds extremely similar, while the extremely grounded, realistic take on Batman's creation sounds a lot like something you'd expect to see in the world Todd Phillips created.

The script was definitely R-Rated, and not even "Bat-Man" himself emerges unscathed. In one early fight, his teeth are knocked out, forcing the wannabe vigilante to wear dentures for the rest of the film. 

The main source of Batman's frustrations is GCPD Commissioner Gillian Loeb, a corrupt cop who secretly rules over Gotham City's criminals...and stole Bruce's fortune.
 

4. The Film's Villain

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Loeb is a character from the Batman: Year One comic, but uses his influence here to take everything that belongs to the Wayne family (hence why poor Bruce ends up on the streets). 

There are no colorful costumed villains in this screenplay, and no sign of Carmine Falcone either. 

Instead, everything revolves around Loeb, a crooked Commissioner who definitely gets what's coming to him. Learning he was responsible for the murder of his parents, Batman throws a knife through his eye, and carves a "Z" (for Zorro) in his cheek. 

This comes after Loeb taunts Batman about his code, and while it does initially look like he's killed his tormentor, it's later revealed that the criminal survived. At the same time, Batman manages to restore Bruce Wayne's fortune, and he and Little Al later move into Wayne Manor together. 
 

3. The Dark Knight's Weaponry

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Had a sequel happened, it's likely Aranofsky might have leaned a little heavier into the comics, depicting a Batman who now had the money to spend on advanced weaponry and tech. 

In this film, however, the Batcave was based in an abandoned subway tunnel, while the Dark Knight's weaponry was very much grounded in reality.

On the Batsuit, he had razor blades on his gauntlets (an idea Catwoman borrowed for her costume), and made use of chemical weapons. That's not too different to how Batman was portrayed in his earliest appearances, though we don't remember that Batman using white phosphorous to burn his foes!

This Batman was a beast, though, and forced one drug deal to eat the product he was selling. 
 

2. A Suicidal Jim Gordon

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Detective Jim Gordon was a big part of Year One's screenplay, but some fans might not have been happy with the way he was sometimes depicted on screen. 

A broken man after spending four years working in Gotham City, he's keen to leave town for the sake of his pregnant wife. 

Jim reluctantly helps The Bat-Man and Catwoman take Loeb down and is, of course, the only honest cop in Gotham. He at one point believes Harvey Dent might be the vigilante, but later reels off his "I’m practically blind without my glasses" line from the comics when Batman is unmasked in front of him.

At one point, however, he sits on the toilet and puts a gun in his mouth, contemplating suicide.
 

1. Why The Film Didn't Happen

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Batman: Year One is a film that wouldn't have appealed to everyone, but it certainly managed to do something new with the character, while putting a fresh spin on his origin story.

So, why was it never made?

This project came at a time when Warner Bros. was still attempting to figure out what to do with the iconic DC superhero, and understandably balked at a take which was heavily R-Rated and a significant departure from how Batman is portrayed in the comics. 

Aronofsky and the studio had vastly different ideas for who should play Bruce (Joaquin Phoenix vs. Freddie Prinze Jr.), and the filmmaker was far from a safe bet at the time. As a result, the decision was made to head in a different direction, and that ended up being Christopher Nolan's Batman Begins.
 

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dracula
dracula - 2/18/2021, 3:03 AM
True, thats the whole idea of Batman and The Joker, their conflict never ending. Doesn’t really have anything to do with a Justice League story though and this would be their first real on screen meeting (would anyone count him being on top of Joker’s car?) so doesn't really have any weight to it.
mastakilla39
mastakilla39 - 2/18/2021, 5:18 AM
@dracula - this is just a dream sequence so Joker may not even be real? These knightmares are executed so stupid. Bruce has to randomly fall asleep throughout a 4.5 hr JL movie just so we can see them? BvS was already stupid how Bruce just fall asleeps while cracking a usb drive with Wonder Woman's photo and Flash pops up randomly like the kool aid guy. Like no wonder he mad, no 1 lets him sleep.
Super12
Super12 - 2/18/2021, 6:33 AM
@mastakilla39 - well its not a dream, its a glimpse into the future due to a break in the time/space fabric caused when Flash travels back through time to warn Bruce about the future, but ok stay mad.
mastakilla39
mastakilla39 - 2/18/2021, 7:04 AM
@Super12 - it's a dream and not real because none of the new directors dont count it either. Batman has PTSD & insomnia so he's [frick]ing crazy like Arthur Fleck. So keep dreaming.
dracula
dracula - 2/18/2021, 11:47 AM
@mastakilla39 - yeah, wasnt sure if its a dream or visions of the future and have anything to do with the flash’s crisis rip off moment
Ha1frican
Ha1frican - 2/18/2021, 5:09 PM
@dracula @mastakilla39 - Im pretty sure its been stated pretty definitively that it was the future, and the premise of the third Justice League movie was using Barry to time travel back and undo that reality. Bruce perceives it as a nightmare bc he doesnt understand it but it was Barry breaking the time barrier and his memories of that timeline flooding in as its breached
mastakilla39
mastakilla39 - 2/18/2021, 6:10 PM
@Ha1frican - He woke up twice. 1st after superman kills him and then 2nd when flash comes. It's a dream within a dream...

Like I said none of the other films count this so its pretty much not canon. Batfleck is gone and Ava Duvurney is rebooting Darkseid with New gods. Therefore its just a nightmare or dream now.
BrainySleep
BrainySleep - 2/18/2021, 3:05 AM
We live in a society where I thought it would be cool
Moriakum
Moriakum - 2/18/2021, 3:06 AM
Dredd97
Dredd97 - 2/18/2021, 6:00 AM
@Moriakum - the fact that he was never cast as the Joker is one of cbm's greatest sins
Doomsday8888
Doomsday8888 - 2/18/2021, 3:09 AM
Maybe not a taste from the knightmare timeline but yeah, some shit obviously happened between them and Robin, question is...will he address that?
inkniron
inkniron - 2/18/2021, 3:12 AM
@Doomsday8888 - This version of Batman should have long since killed him. There's no reason to let him live anymore.
Doomsday8888
Doomsday8888 - 2/18/2021, 3:15 AM
@inkniron
Indeed.

And yet, i think he's even gonna team up with him! :P
dracula
dracula - 2/18/2021, 3:19 AM
@inkniron - yeah, snyder for some reason did a killed batman.......and he kills everyone except the killer clown.
inkniron
inkniron - 2/18/2021, 3:25 AM
@Doomsday8888 - Probably but that's just infinitely dumb. What's the benefit vs the New Gods? Is it his awesome fighting skills or his metahuman abilities? He probably wouldn't last long as cannon fodder and I get the feeling this Bats would prefer to off him himself.
InfinitePunches
InfinitePunches - 2/18/2021, 3:26 AM
@Doomsday8888 - He IS Robin.
Doomsday8888
Doomsday8888 - 2/18/2021, 3:32 AM
@inkniron
Man, don't even get me started on that.

I dunno if you've read Joker War, but they just wont kill Joker.
I mean, forget Batman, even a corrupt officer could kill him.
Now we have a Batman who kills here but still...nada.🤷‍♂️

@InfinitePunches
You probably jest, but i could legit see that happening.
Visualiza
Visualiza - 2/18/2021, 3:12 AM
"Batman/Joker are kind of the - that conflict is central to the universe,"

Not *this* universe, because the relationship between them hasn't been properly established, so it doesn't mean anything.
bkmeijer2
bkmeijer2 - 2/18/2021, 3:12 AM
I'm assuming Batman wants something from Joker. And to stay in line with Snyder's vision, Batman kills Jojer after he gets it
Spock0Clock
Spock0Clock - 2/18/2021, 3:20 AM
So, is this intentional shade against Ayer's movie or what...?
Moriakum
Moriakum - 2/18/2021, 3:20 AM
I love how Affleck's Batman murderers bad guys left and right but lets Joker and other high profile villains live.
inkniron
inkniron - 2/18/2021, 3:27 AM
"Batman/Joker are kind of the - that conflict is central to the universe,"

Here I was thinking it was Hack vs vibrant colors or good story telling.
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