Whats Wrong With Warner Bros. Part 1

Nolan may have inadvertently doomed DC CBM’s through no fault of his own, but because of Warner Bros.’ limited, visionless, text book, way of thinking, they want to use his formula for everything.

Editorial Opinion
By Tevii - Feb 19, 2013 10:02 AM EST
Filed Under: Other

The debate continues as to why Warner Bros. can’t get a Comic Book Movie right to save their lives. And yes, the problem is Warner Bros. NOT DC and definitely not their characters. DC is a victim of the corporate minds at Warner Bros. I love DC characters and I see the potential they have, so the point of writing this is to be constructive, not just to bitch. And let me clarify, this isn’t a Marvel vs. DC thing either, because I have the mental capacity to enjoy them both, but I love DC and their pantheon, so I hate how they are being treated.

Im breaking this article into three Parts 1) Movies 2) Comics, Television and Animation 3) Suggestions



Having been a marketer, creative director and writer for over twelve years and having to consult in similar such corporate environments many times, the problem seems crystal clear to me and I can speculate at the things happening behind closed doors at WB: They are being Reactive to whatever is successful; they are not Proactive with anything. Whatever is successful they simply try to hop on the bandwagon.


PART 1 - MOVIES

At first WB was against a shared universe due to the success of The Dark Knight, then they reconsidered when Marvel was so successful and Green Lantern failed. Then they were against a JLA movie, now they want one because of the success of Avengers. EVERYTHING they do is reactive, tit-for-tat.

Their answer to Iron Man: they have Barry Sonnenfeld developing Metal Men, or their answer to Wolverine: a Lobo film. Now, Avengers is successful, so they plan a JLA movie… and a JLA Dark. All that these decisions mean, are that the execs don’t know a anything . Again, they just look for what’s SIMILAR in their pantheon to something that is already successful.

Well, first off, Lobo and Metal Men are both poor choices that don’t need to be made before characters such as Flash, Martian Manhunter or Aquaman. Second, as much as I want to see a JLA movie, they can’t honestly believe it will have the level of success that the Avengers had. Besides the fact that Avengers was a great movie, the reason it was so successful is it had the Iron Man, Thor, Captain America: First Avenger and The Incredible Hulk movies all acting as 2 hour long commercials spread over years, building up the hype for Avengers. (I knew way back, before they even picked a Director, when Avatar smashed records I said, when Avengers comes out it will come close if not beat Avatar simply because of the number of years in it’s marketing campaign.) Then finally there’s JL Dark, yes that could be a cool film, but again not on the top of any priority list. But the execs at WB probably think “hey let’s make a JLA and a JL Dark movie too, we’ll be twice as successful as Avengers”.



The Dark Knight elevated CBM’s in the eyes of many viewers, but at the same time, Nolan may have inadvertently doomed DC CBM’s through no fault of his own but because of Warner Bros.’ limited, visionless, text book, way of thinking, they want to use his formula for everything. Only an idiot would think that a single formula will work for all characters. There is no single formula. Nolan’s approach works for street level heroes only. (I bet he could make a KILLER Daredevil movie)

To the execs at Warner Bros…. Do Your Due Diligence and stop trying to find a “universal formula” that will work on all your characters. “Edgier and darker” isn’t the answer either. I understand market research, but seriously, obviously it isn’t working very well for you. Trust the source material, and try hiring people that love your characters, then trust them to handle them correctly.
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Spideyguy94
Spideyguy94 - 2/19/2013, 10:46 AM
I honestly think WB don't know what they have with they're DC properties. I'm excited for man of steel but apart from that I don't care about what happens with the DC movies anymore.
tonytony
tonytony - 2/19/2013, 12:20 PM
What doomed a jl film was the crappy superman returns. If that was succesful wb would have created a shared universe with fantasy characters. Green lantern was also crap. I think if man of steel is succesful then it will all ignite the dc universe. You cant blame wb for protecting batman and his universe after the poor perfomance of other movies. It has proved right and they got a few billion out of it. If they get MOS right then we will see more.
tonytony
tonytony - 2/19/2013, 12:25 PM
Green lantern had no heart it was almost like because it wasnt grounded they thought it would work with a silly tone.
I think with Mos they are taking the characters seriously and combining the fantasy element of the character with the real world we live in which should make it more compelling viewing.
jessepostal
jessepostal - 2/19/2013, 12:45 PM
Wb took a few big hits and now they are taking baby steps to make sure it's the right decision. It's business 101, some bad movies were made that didn't make a profit or lost a lot of money, you can't make a justice league movie with out it being a big budget summer flick, is it worth the risk to shell out that much money if its not going to do well at this time? Everyone says they are making bad decisions but when your mortgage is due and there is also that brand new expensive item you want... Which do you pick?
Knightrider
Knightrider - 2/19/2013, 1:10 PM
Warner Bros. issue is basically is doesn't need to rely on making comicbook based movies to survive unlike Marvel studios.

However, what I will say is: Warner Bros. may not need CBM to survive, but they green light several projects that I just can't believe will make as much or more than something like a Wonder Woman or Justice League.
Knightrider
Knightrider - 2/19/2013, 1:24 PM
Plus, with the JL script apprantly being awful, WB are waiting to see how MoS does both financially and audience reaction, probably the smartest move from them.

If MoS is successful WB will have a solid foundation to build upon and can retain the tone and feel in their other movies. It is basically what Marvel did with IM1, which was a massive success so they knew the tone, feel, and formula worked and thus continued it.

So, if we thought MoS had pressure on it before, when it looked like the WB were going to make a JL movie anyways, but now it actually is carrying a universe on its shoulders.
Knightrider
Knightrider - 2/19/2013, 2:07 PM
@ Levitikuz I agree in part with what you are saying, but once 'The Hobbit' is finished the WB may not have another franchise.

Plus when they own the entire DC universe they pretty much have a never ending stream of franchises, some can tie together, some can be solo but exist in the same universe, while others can be completely solo.

WB does have other projects, but it is also a business, one that is sitting on a gold mine, especially now while CBMs are in vogue, and they seem very reluctant to utilise what they already own.
tonytony
tonytony - 2/19/2013, 2:17 PM
@black yellow i feel you. However wouldnt it make sense to have a studio dedicated to comic books within the group? you could give them like a billion and tell them to develop the DC comics universe.
I would like to see a flash or wonder woman movie under the WB banner as they will give it the proper Cinematic treatment as long as they make the tone serious.

DC has lots of iconic franchises which can all be developed into epic properties. It just needs the right story teller.

I have no doubt that man of steel will be successful and become the next tentpole franchise for them the good thing with Superman is that all heroes can exist in his universe, so once that does the business hopefully it will give them the encouragement they need to get behind more of the fantasy characters.
EdgyOutsider
EdgyOutsider - 2/19/2013, 2:41 PM
Warner Bros. will have another franchise in Mortal Kombat once they get things going by getting rid of Tancharoen and get someone that's worthy and good.
TheSuperguy
TheSuperguy - 2/19/2013, 3:13 PM
Hoping MOS makes WB wise up about how to handle franchises. Just give us a good Superman trilogy before expanding your universe.
Tainted87
Tainted87 - 2/19/2013, 3:25 PM
Nothing wrong with the Metal Men, although we accidentally agree here.

Whatever possible Metal Men movie is made, it has nothing to do with Iron Man's success, nor would Lobo have anything to do with the success of a Wolverine movie. Lobo has much more in common with Deadpool than Wolverine, and the Metal Men have more in common with the X-Men.

Have we seen a Doom Patrol movie following the (soon-to-be) seven X-Men-related titles? How about a Challengers of the Unknown attempt to the Fantastic Four blunders? No?

Well then, how about something recent, like Thor? Where's the Wonder Woman and Aquaman features that we'd find comparable and formulaic?

They are no more reactive than any other studio, no more reactive than Target to Walmart, or Burger King to McDonald's.

So here's where I'd scratch my fake goatee and twirl my non-existent mustache.
The Metal Men is a very obscure team. They could definitely hold their own movie by themselves, but there's really no demand for them outside of any vintage comic reader. So the issue, rather than a problem, is that the Metal Men is much more fitting within a junior-year curriculum than any freshman or sophomore approach.

Spider-man is a freshman character. You don't have to be a fan to enjoy the movies, you don't have to have read a single comic in fact to like em. He is an entry level character, just as well as Batman.

What is so dazzling is how Iron Man previously was considered sophomore at the earliest, yet in 2008, it's like everyone instantly became a fan without having read a comic, without having even seen or cared about Robert Downey Jr. Favreau, Feige, Downey, and Black made this character approachable to action fans, and loveable to a community that grew exponentially with Iron Man's success.

DC/WB needs an Iron Man-like hit to inject interest in the less approachable characters in order to have an audience wanting a Metal Men movie.
Tainted87
Tainted87 - 2/19/2013, 3:26 PM
And you all knew this was coming....
WTF?! Is that Vin Diesel as J'onn?! GTFO... just do it.
jessepostal
jessepostal - 2/19/2013, 3:59 PM
@jollem, it is that simple, I wish more people would see things that way. Simple sells, if you don't believe me, look at today's top 40
TheSuperguy
TheSuperguy - 2/19/2013, 6:28 PM
@Tainted
I think WB intended for GREEN LANTERN to be their IRON MAN. And we all know how that turned out.
gamecreatorjj
gamecreatorjj - 2/19/2013, 6:46 PM
I dont think you can say that WB is all reaction, when the closest thing we have seen to them reacting is Green Lantern's ironman esque take, they haven't made anything else thats reacting, they kind of just stick to what they do, and they are doing it far smarter than disney, the market is becoming dilluted, we are seeing a peak for super hero films, and just like the stock market, when it gets to high, it crashes

to some WB look like fools, for not profiting off all the characters, but when you have as many films as disney has planned, and is already preparing for release, you have massive profit drop, WB making one every 2 or three years is working in their favor for the long run

WB knows when not to make a film, which is why we didn't see superman V until the market was rising, we have superhero films making mediocre money at best and they are planning sequel after sequel, it's bad business. Thats not to say they are doing everything right, Warner brothers works for the long term, Disney works for the short term, both have their advantages, its just a matter of the state of the market now, compared to the future.
tonytony
tonytony - 2/19/2013, 9:07 PM
The thing is surely a flash or wonder woman movie would be better and more profitable than a lobo or metal men movie.
EdgyOutsider
EdgyOutsider - 2/19/2013, 10:19 PM
@levi: Maybe not a full fledged franchise but four films max is doable for Mortal Kombat. Get rid of Tancharoen and I believe it can work. If people would get past the blood and gore and look at it as a story and see the potential in the franchise as a story. I think it would be a no brainer.
Tevii
Tevii - 2/19/2013, 10:52 PM
@LEVITIKUZ - The fact that they produce so many other things is no excuse to produce the crap they do when it comes to CBMs.

They need a strategy for that just like they do for everything else.

And as I plainly state in the article, Im not bitching for the sake of bitching. Constructive criticism is how anything gets fixed.
Tevii
Tevii - 2/19/2013, 10:53 PM
and if they cant figure it out, then perhaps they have spread themselves too thin and should consider selling DC
Tevii
Tevii - 2/20/2013, 2:16 AM
fangz - I dont beleive they would sell DC. thats just wishful thinking on my part. Even if they did it would never be BACK to DC it would be another large corporation. But if they keep making Jonah Hex, Catwoman and bad GL movies they will abandon CBMs for a while.

Corporate bigwigs dont look at it the way you are describing in terms of DC selling them on it. They dont give a crap about anything anyone at DC has to say, only the crappy market research they use to determine stuff.

and yes Im aware WB has other franchises other than CBMs on their hands, but thats a STUPID excuse. Their goal should be to never put out a crappy product PERIOD the ROI would be higher.
EdgyOutsider
EdgyOutsider - 2/20/2013, 7:00 AM
@SotoJuiceMan: I brought it up as an idea for their next big franchise outside of DC Comics. I actually liked the original Mortal Kombat. Sure, it wasn't dark, bloody, gory or violent. But, it still stuck to the material. The only problems with the 1995 film was the cheesy dialouge, bad effects and at times, bad acting. I want Tancharoen away for Mortal Kombat 1)Cause of the Mortal Kombat: Rebirth pitch. Anyone who liked it obviously didn't realize it was for MK and 2)He likes things realistic. Sure, Season Two isn't as realistic as the first Season but, he's still not sticking to the material. An Mortal Kombat fan that doesn't stick to the material? Yea, he shoudl GTFO.
Archangel82
Archangel82 - 2/20/2013, 10:20 AM
WB can't make a great comic book movie outside of Batman and Superman simply because of Green Lanterns failure. They are afraid of going outside of the box. The Marvel films worked well because they hired writers and directors who were passionate about the source material. WB is afraid to hand over their characters over to a lesser known director who just wants to make a good movie. Instead they give their characters to bigger directors who are deemed worthy based on their mainstream senseablity.
EdgyOutsider
EdgyOutsider - 2/20/2013, 12:27 PM
@Soto: I don't care about the gore when it comes to adapting it. I'll give Tancharoen props for being closer to the games with the web series but, he isn't pronouncing some of the things correctly, and some of the characters look nothing like the characters their suppose to be *cough cough* Ermac. Basing off of the teaser for season two, it looks like his take on Lui Kang might as well be Kung Lao cause he looks more like Kung Lao and the person playing Kung Lao looks like Raiden. Nothing about Mortal Kombat: Legacy has a MK feel to it. Nothing about the web series left me wanting more. It's good for what t is. I watched the next episode cause the previous one was decent.

As a fan personally, I won't ever think of his take on it as Mortal Kombat. Nothing about it feels or looks like the material it's based off of with the exception of Sektor, Cyrax, Stryker and Shang Tsung (bringing the original actor back is one thing he did right). The new game was an alternate timeline cause of the time travel more-less what it is.
Until Tancharoen gets it right and makes it at least look and feel like Mortal Kombat. It'll be nothing to me except fan-made. The reboot needs to be the opposite of the web series. Complete opposite in my opinion if they want it to be successful and start of a trilogy or franchise. Either that or Tancharoen needs to leave it. Those are just my personal feelings.
EdgyOutsider
EdgyOutsider - 2/20/2013, 3:00 PM
I know what they do through out the second film. Believe me, I have yet to decide if Annihilation is worse than Batman & Robin or not. I always pictured Ermac how he looked in the last game. While obviously not down to the exact detail, I imagined it to be close to what he looks like in the game. The web series version is more of a movie monster from what they've shown of him. Yes, I play Mortal Kombat for the violence and characters. But, what's wrong with story? All I'm saying is, why not balance it like the first movie but different and a bit darker. Without trying to make it realistic. I get that Rebirth was to show his vision as a artistic director. But, even to this day, the fact that it has any characters or names of the characters in it as a fan, offended me as a fan cause it was everything that Mortal Kombat isn't outside of the violence. The reboot and web series are to bring in a new audience. I get that too. But, why not introduce them to what Mortal Kombat is. Yes, have the blood and violence. But, also the stories and characters are to be respected too. Personally, if I were him, I would want the audience to be there not just to see it for the violence, blood, gore and if their characters are in it. I would want them to see it because of the story and cause its Morral Kombat and pure fantasy.
Tainted87
Tainted87 - 2/20/2013, 4:08 PM
I like Jeri Ryan
EdgyOutsider
EdgyOutsider - 2/21/2013, 2:37 PM
@Ashleytdkr: I prefer the Marvel films (besides being a Marvel fan) because they act like and most of them accept that they are comicbook movies. I hate that "The Dark Knight" started the realistic trend. It's so dumb. Batman even has his fair share of comicbook-y villains. Dark and realistic is boring anymore. Not saying that the movies are bad. Just, that trend is so boring.
tonytony
tonytony - 2/23/2013, 10:56 PM
Boring in your opinion. Two non 3d billion dollar movies says shows that many fans dont agree with you.
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