Optimus Prime: "I'll Kill Them All!" ??

Transformers...

Editorial Opinion
By BellHorneKing - Jun 30, 2011 01:06 AM EST
Filed Under: Transformers
Source: wikipedia

[No spoilers here. Trust me.]

AWESOME ROBOTS: INVASION!

That could have been the title of the latest Michael Bay epic Transformers film, and it would have been fine with me. Had the robots not resembled my childhood mechanical heroes, I wouldn’t have minded one bit, and I still would have enjoyed seeing this grand spectacle with all of its mindless action, and explosive wonder.

As it turns out, the source material caught my interest because of the colorful backstories and excellent attention to character heroics and noble attributes of these fascinating characters. Accidentally, the Transformers cartoon and comic book series actually ended up being some very well written science fiction that just happened to be aimed at my very young demographic.

The creators of this movie franchise must have known that the kiddies would be all grown up and would expect the restrictions of television to be cast away for an all new, more adult-oriented Transformers. Right?

Wrong.



See, you can ask any Transformers fan who enjoyed the genre before the Michael Bay movies came out, and they’ll probably tell you it had something to do with this character known as Optimus Prime.
Now, I’ve seen the fan reactions to this character. Some are reverant. Some are nostalgic to the point of being laughable.

Take this one young fan’s story;
"I remember when I was 8. My parents had left me to live with my grandfather, who was a World War II veteran, and had stepped in to be responsible when my own parents were too flaky. He was loving, respectable, strong, had a voice that sounded like John Wayne, and drove a sturdy, new automobile. He taught me everything I needed to know about being a man.

Anyway, he died in 1986, the same year that Transformers: The Movie came out. Even though during my grandfather’s funeral I was too young and immature to be able to express the sorrow I felt at my hero passing away, when I was sitting in the theatre that summer and witnessed the amazing sacrificial act that Optimus Prime did to save the day, the tears flowed.

And I certainly wasn’t the only kid. See, there were a lot of kids in my 4th grade class that were indifferent to the Transformers, many that just liked the rudimentary fun of it all, but still – amongst all of my boyhood buddies, we all knew the stories, knew the characters, and respected the hell out of their leader, the most revered bad-ass of all time; Optimus Prime."

Well, that kid is now 32 years old, and he just got finished watching the 3rd and final Michael Bay treatment of his boyhood toy franchise, and ya know what?

He didn’t like seeing such a vibrant, noble hero being turned into a cold blooded, common murderer.
Peter Cullen once said he drew certain lines where Optimus’ dialogue was concerned, whenever he felt “Prime wouldn’t do that.” One wonders where that old-fashioned accountability is now.

Let's imagine Christopher Reeve's Superman callously ignoring an enemy's cry for mercy, and stepping in heartlessly for the death blow. Would have tarnished the red, blue and yellow that make up the same primary colors that define Op. See what I mean?



Maybe when Transformers was created, it was purely to sell toys, and to do that the cartoons had to display impossible virtue. Decades later, in order to sell movie tickets, these cartoon characters have to display base immorality and turn into stone cold killers.

You missed the mark, Mr. Bay. Your movie may make a zillion dollars, and since money is all that counts in the world of today, I’m sure you’ll sleep just fine at night. Just know that the reason that me and a lot of people like me streamed into the movie theaters wasn't because we were anxious to see your camera skill, and ability to succesfully blow shit up amidst snappy urban dialogue.

Hey, it's just the movies right? You've got no obligation to craft a big moral tale, and truth is, your treatment of these characters is never going to inspire any young people to do the right things, to respect others, and to lead by good example.

And that’s a shame, because at one point in history; that’s EXACTLY what these characters did.


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contrast
contrast - 6/30/2011, 4:53 AM
That... is the best comment of all time @Teabag
Hellsing
Hellsing - 6/30/2011, 5:52 AM
I don't think theres any need for me to say anything after teabags comment(which is pretty epic btw)
CorndogBurglar
CorndogBurglar - 6/30/2011, 6:16 AM
@ Tea

i think this guy is a little confused. You're right, Prime and the rest of the Autobots were killing Decepticons like it was going out of style in the movie.

also, Prime didn't make some heroic sacrifice when he died, he got tricked like a chump. if you remember, Megatron was kneeling on the ground with his back to Prime, begging for his life. When Prime lowered his gun, Megatron turned around and blasted the shit out of him, lol. Thats not a heroic sacrifice, thats stupidity.

How many times had Prime fought Megatron at that point? like at least 5 times a week. it was his full time job. and he still fell for that? maybe if Prime would have smoked him, then he wouldn't have died.

Also, Tea is right, I've been watching horror movies, playing violent video games, and listening to offensive music since i was a little burglar of corndogs. Now I have a wife and beautiful child, and we live very productive lives. I've never even considered killing someone, or anything that ignorant people claim these things lead to.

its parenting, plain and simple. If you're so incompetent as a parent to not teach your kids between reality and fantasy, then you don't deserve to have a kid. and you know what? those are the people that end up having kids that do crazy shit. its not the movies, video games, or music. thats just a crutch that lazy parents use to defend their shitty parenting.
CorndogBurglar
CorndogBurglar - 6/30/2011, 8:11 AM
@ Nephillim

I agree to an extent. 616 Cap is the fan favorite, but i think its more because he's the one everyone knows and loves.

Ultimate Cap is by far the more realistic, and updated version. Think about it. 616 Cap never used to use guns, not even during one of the bloodiest and violent wars in history. I don't care how super of a soldier you are, if you didn't have a gun, you were toast during WWII.

Ultimate Cap used a gun during the war, and had the attitude i would picture a soldier of that time having.

and look at it like this, 616 Steve Rogers has even been using a gun now in the comics. and not some tranquilizer or something, its an actual handgun he's been using.

so even the good natured, non-murderous 616 Cap of old has been updated to be a little more realistic :)
rlj399
rlj399 - 6/30/2011, 9:32 AM
I agree with the article. The attitudes of the protagonists ruined the movie for me. It's not that we believe kids are going to go around killing people because of this movie or that kids are going to worship satan because of heavy metal, but that the more subtle moral fiber of society is being attacked. It's a solid fact that kids immitate their role models. Little girls will dress up in their moms heels and put on her make up and little boys will pretend to shave along with their dads. So, when you see these 'heroic' role models (optimus and sam) acting like total heartless douchebags, it really doesn't set the bar high for the social standards we would want our kids to have. Sure, a hero having a gun and an edgy attitude is realistic, but is it a good that thing? If people keep supporting these kinds of subtle messages, then mankind will be taking a step back to primitive times where the law of the land is an eye for an eye. We need to support true justice and order, where we refuse to drop to the level of criminals and continue a chain of violence and vengeance.

Sure, I enjoyed the visuals of the movie, but the characters were tasteless. Without good characters what more is a movie than a pretty light show?
superbatspiderman
superbatspiderman - 6/30/2011, 9:34 AM
Optimus Prime is not a killer he is a warrior and in war its killed or be killed. The Decepticons are evil blood thirsty beings and Optimus and the Autobots have to defend Earth from them at any means necessary. Killing the Decepticons is the lesser of two evils than letting them ravage innocent civilians.
Joker11
Joker11 - 6/30/2011, 9:44 AM
@Tea great words bro I fully agree!
I thought optimus was awesome! I love that line "We will kill them all" badass.
CapFan79
CapFan79 - 6/30/2011, 10:50 AM
I've seen this criticism quite a bit lately. Understand that Prime didn't kill in the show because it was for kids and they were selling products. They needed the "product placement" each week so killing them off was bad advertising.

In the animated film HASBRO decided they wanted to sell new toys so they just killed off everyone.

In the case of DOTM it's not reasonable that Optimus would let Sentinel Prime live after the betrayal and destruction of their homeworld. It also doesn't make sense in a war to just capture everyone. This is the 3rd film in the trilogy and for closure characters had to be killed.

Your idea of what Optimus should do is based on a cartoon, but in the movie his actions make sense in the real world. He's a warrior. These films are about the Autobot and Decepticon war. There's really only one way to win (and it usually isn't negotiation).

Sentinel was about to finish off Optimus and was responsible for the events of the film (you know - the invasion and murder of humans and Autobots)! Optimus as a wise leader could not trust him. There was no other choice.

No offense, but your friend should be a big boy now based on his age so maybe he shouldn't get butt hurt over a movie and should just remember his grandfather as the hero he was rather than a toy.
CorndogBurglar
CorndogBurglar - 6/30/2011, 11:36 AM
@ capfan

well played, sir!
CorndogBurglar
CorndogBurglar - 6/30/2011, 11:37 AM
but still, optimus and the autobots were killing decepticons left and right in the old animated movie
Hellsing
Hellsing - 6/30/2011, 11:55 AM
@CorndogBurglar I gotta agree with you dude I like the fact that they updated the comics and they now show Cap using guns in WW2(really glad that didn't shy away from that in the movie).
CapFan79
CapFan79 - 6/30/2011, 12:12 PM
To make another point. I hate when "heroes" and leaders don't have the BALLS to the the job that HAS to be done.

It's nice to be "noble" and judicious in battle, but sometimes you gotta do the hard thing and kill. Sometimes it's the only justice!

To me, Optimus did what he needed to to save the Earth and his Autobots. That's not immoral.

If you're not happy then buy some Kleenex.
Joker11
Joker11 - 6/30/2011, 12:33 PM
This movie was epic optimus was so badass in the last fight with megatron and sentinel. I don't agree with the article. Heroes have to do what they have to do to keep the world safe and right.

Optimus thought the best way to carry that out was to hit megatron in the face with an axe and rip his head off then shoot sentinel multiple times. If he wouldnt of killed them then they might of come back and did more damage then they already did.

Sometimes the good choice isnt the right one. Sometimes you gotta go down the not so good path but it gets the job done.
Supes17
Supes17 - 6/30/2011, 1:01 PM
Sometimes you HAVE to make the choice to kill.

Take BB and TDK for example, Bruce let Ducard/ Ra's al Ghul live and he came back to cause damage ro Gotham.

In TDK, if Batman would have killed the Joker, Rachel would have lived, Harvey wouln't have turned crazy, and all the mobsters would still be in jail. Batman's tank wouldn't have been destroyed, the city wouldn't have the need for evacuation.

He learned his lesson at the end and let Harvey die in order to save Gordon's son
BellHorneKing
BellHorneKing - 6/30/2011, 1:14 PM
The choice to take a life is sometimes necessary. Especially in war.

But do real heroes take it lightly? No. No, they do not.

And that's my point; this movie has a real hero. One who was poorly written.

And as the recent lambasting of Green Lantern is proof of; poorly written comic/sci-fi movies are a legit reason to take issue.

@Corndog I'm glad you grew up a productive member of society considering the shit you were exposed to as a child!
logunvadercap
logunvadercap - 6/30/2011, 8:29 PM
i have two boys and they watch all the old transformers and gi joe. you have to be a PARENT. show them right from wrong. be an example.
@tea- i do listen to heavy metal and worship the dark one, BELZABUBBA! i'm from arkansas.
plus robots killing robots is fvcking awesome!
logunvadercap
logunvadercap - 6/30/2011, 8:34 PM
i try and slay shit all the time. at least in the bedroom. the misses says a have a small dick, but i try and tell her even a 747 looks small landing in the grand canyon.
WeakSauceWTF
WeakSauceWTF - 7/1/2011, 2:42 PM
There is so many things wrong this page I dont know where to begin. I have liked this site ever since I found it one day surfing the internet instead of doing class work in school and this is the first time I have ever seen someone take down an actual character instead of the actor playing him/her or how the director has them written. In all honesty you have missed the mark completely on who Optimus Prime is and what he did in this movie.

If your basing him turning into a "cold blooded common murderer" off that one line you have to be joking. I mean if you want to go that way did you not watch Revenge of the Fallen? first opening highway fight scene he blasted a decepticon square in face, and right before he died he ripped another one's face completely apart. Also talking about one asking for mercy if watch at the end the fallen running and trying to scream (but his face is gone) and Optimus ripped out his spark. Might just be me but I dont remember anyone calling him a murderer then.

Optimus excepted Earth as his and the autobots' new home, and from the very first movie one of his main goals is to protect Earth from any decepticon treat which he did in the 3rd movie.

Optimus isnt stupid. After Sentinel Prime revealed that he was actually working with Megatron and killed Ironside, Optimus knew this was going to be an all out fight no going back and trying to get them to change their minds. If he didnt stop them then Earth and all of the humans living on it were going to die or be enslaved and once they do that to Earth whos to say they wouldnt move on to the next. Its like he said in ROTF "You'll never stop at one, I'll take you all on!" and thats what he did. He put his own life on the line in all 3 movies time and again to make sure Earth and all the people living on it were safe.

I'll admit the first tv series and movie were before I was born but I still have seen it. These movies are suppose to be about real life and not a cartoon where everything ends happily but to say they arent role models because of this is totally unfair I wish I could be nearly half as brave as Optimus Prime has been in all 3 of these movies.

Also to say Peter Cullen has kinda of sold out or something is complete crap also I believe he knows Optimus Prime best out of anyone and he would know exactly how he would feel and what he would say.
TFanBoy67
TFanBoy67 - 7/1/2011, 5:03 PM
And did you not see what Megatron and Sentinel did? The decepticons planned on using the humans as slave labor? they killed innocent humans, and killed Ironhide, who is his best friend and righthand man. And people are taking the pleaing too seriously. Megatron just mentioned a truce so he could live. Sentinel just was being a coward and did not want to man up for his actions. and what WeakSause said... Earth is their HOME now the humans showed no mercy, so why should the autobots. And when Optimus told Megatron, "lets find out", he meant Megatron caused all this horrible stuff... like he said in the first movie, you left me no choice brother, i'm sure OP took no joy in killing him, he just knew with Megatron gone, his new home would be safe. I know where your coming from bro, but you gotta look at it realistically,sorry.
BigK1337
BigK1337 - 7/1/2011, 7:09 PM
Okay, this article just deserves a facepalm; I can even imagine God facepalming the hell out of this.

Yeah, killing is wrong in all terms; but this isn't a Transformers cartoon. Also, even in the cartoons (mainly the movie) the Autobots have to kill the Decepticons with no choice. So in the end, sometimes most great heroes have to make the choice between taking a life to save millions, or keep the enemy alive to risk more lifes.

Though yeah, the stuff in the movie is pretty violent for a younger audience.
BellHorneKing
BellHorneKing - 7/2/2011, 7:55 PM
Thanks, Areajerm. Your single, intelligent response makes up for the kids in the room who don't know any better.
WeakSauceWTF
WeakSauceWTF - 7/2/2011, 8:59 PM
You two are just out to paint him as a bad guy and which is pretty sad Im just glad we all got to see the Optimus Prime for the real hero he is in this film because if we would of had your verison we all would be enslaved rebuilding Cybertron or dead.

Your right though Optimus doesnt seek out violence and give an example where he did. Anytime I can think of he is either defending Sam or any other human or the planet is being taken over didnt know that could be stopped through talking it out...

I'm also not seeing where your getting all this "ruthless killer" crap from. Ever the since the ending of the first movie when Optimus said "One shall stand and one shall fall" I thought everyone knew what was going to go down between him and Megatron and with Sentinel he called him out knowing this was going to be a fight to death also because Sentinel was bent on bringing Cybertron back no matter the cost and that cost was Earth.

Joker11
Joker11 - 7/3/2011, 3:08 AM
This article is shit. You seriously have no [frick]ing clue what your talking about.
Read Teas And Corndogs response's, and mine cause we actually understand why Optimus kills.
Dumbass.
TheTyrant82
TheTyrant82 - 7/4/2011, 6:18 AM
Ummmmm.....I really dont wanna sound like a hater, but that movie could have been put together a whole lot better. I see what you guys are talking about with the whole Prime killing Megatron and Sentinel, but come the $#@% on. Seriously......you guys gave OP that W against Megatron with one arm....really....C'mon....I have no problem with OP beating Mega but lets not make it look like Megatron's not a top tear General like OP. They sweat OP too much in these movies.....Its kinda lame.....And bee killed Soundwave AND Starscream....really......It was getting absurd.....I know you guys have already figured it out....Im a deceptcon follower and Im ready to accept the L, but at least they could have done the fights scences a little bit better. It was like DBZ....All the autobots cant fight off one silly deceptcon but OP hits the scence and he's off to the races......It was like "Really, I didnt know Goku was in this movie....."....And the way they took the story was a little whack.....and yes before anyone says anything, I know...Its just a movie...We all just went there to see robots fighting and transforming.....Na, the problem I had was that it would have made more sense if it was OP/Sentinal vs. Mega/Shockwave....But no...they had OP kill ALL of them...That was a tough sell.....They wasted an hr with the army running around and that was boring. The only good fight was OP vs Sentinal. That fight was REALLY good....And what was Megatron's deal.....He was walking around like he lost all confidence in his cause....And could somebody please fix his face.....and I dont wanna here that sh!t that they couldnt.....What??..we could raise him from the dead in the 2nd movie but GOD forbid that some go to advanced autoparts and get some materials to fix him up....Hey...Im just saying they could have done a better job...but there is no such thing as a perfect movie.....It still was entertaing........and Im kinda blown that they gave Ol' OP the W againts my boy but it is what it is..but............ALL HAIL MEGATRON!!!!!!......XD
havehope
havehope - 7/7/2011, 1:25 PM
well said. I can't think of a single word I can add to that PERFECT review.
Complete perfection.

May the Bayformer franchise be well and truly forgotten.
stevencday
stevencday - 7/13/2011, 8:49 AM
I agree with BellHorneKing completely. Killing and murder are two different things. And yes, I do believe that art should challenge us to raise our ideals and ask us to question what is right and wrong. Are parents the biggest influence on children's moral compass? Of course. But to say that books, music, and films do not play a major role in shaping moral fiber would be ridiculous. Anything that communicates has the ability to shape our opinions and ideas about the world we live in.

I also felt like in the last two films Optimus Prime showed evil qualities. A hero should be selfless, honest, and merciful. Essentially he/she should be love in action. Is love ruthless and destructive? Well, yes it is, when it comes to protecting the innocent from evil. But love is also merciful when your enemy is unarmed and begging for his life.

How many of you believe Tom Hank's character in Saving Private Ryan made the wrong choice in letting the Germans go? It was one of these he showed mercy to that ended up killing him. But I tell you, even though it ended in his own death, it was what was RIGHT, and that's the point. That is not stupidity or weakness, it is what separates good from evil. And because of his sacrifice, Private Ryan was able to make it home safely.

Look at Bilbo Baggins, he showed mercy to Gollum, and even though many evils were done by allowing Gollum to live, evil was ultimately destroyed because of Bilbo's mercy, and Bilbo himself was saved from a Gollum-like fate.

Look at the Jesus story in the bible. Through sacrifice, he was able to destroy death. Nobility and goodness does not always end if superficial victories, but we are talking about something far deeper and more important.

It is my opinion that Optimus Prime should be a symbol of love, self-sacrifice, humility, and strength. A warrior in battle, but a merciful judge, and killing your enemy, execution-style, while he begs for his life, is not the kind of hero I want or need.
WeakSauceWTF
WeakSauceWTF - 7/13/2011, 9:49 AM
Really? We are now comparing Optimus to Jesus? I dont know whats evil about protecting entire world from people that want to come in and take it over.

Hate to break it to you all but in the cartoon movie Optimus was going to totally kill Megatron but Hot Rod got in the way. I mean what do you all think he was doing when the Cybertron war was going on? Just beating them down and letting them go? Nope.

When has Optimus ever talked about loving something? He believes all worlds should be free Decepticons dont want that so he has to stop them at whatever the cost. Dont forget they are also robots doesnt mean if they blow up they are gone forever as we have seen in the movies. They numerous ways to bring fallen transformers back.

stevencday
stevencday - 7/13/2011, 1:43 PM
All heros would be compared to Jesus, of course. Because Jesus represents the pinnacle of a rescue operation where good swoops in and saves the day at the last minute, and doing it while not compromising goodness. The whole point is to destroy evil without becoming evil. That's what goodness is. It never shrouds itself as evil or plays make-believe. It is always good, and it is unashamedly so. If a thief breaks into my house, I am going to kill him if I can, not out of hatred for him, but out of love for my family. However, if he is cornered and wishes to be spared and surrenders himself, I would go to prison for murder if I killed him, would I not? Again, the difference between good and evil.
WeakSauceWTF
WeakSauceWTF - 7/13/2011, 3:41 PM
Im almost positive no hero in comics is compared to Jesus because Jesus didnt promote violence. I cant even believe you went there with that, totally off subject, and to your whole thief example well the humans and earth are Optimus's family now he even said that Earth is their home and the Decepticons what enslave earth to rebuild Cybertron and Optimus wasnt going to let that happen, and that was Sentinel's goal to use Earth or any other planet for that matter to rebuild Cybertron and Optimus knew that not to mention he killed Ironhide and other Autobots when he defected so Optimus did what he needed to do to save everyone on the planet.
WeakSauceWTF
WeakSauceWTF - 7/13/2011, 3:41 PM
Im almost positive no hero in comics is compared to Jesus because Jesus didnt promote violence. I cant even believe you went there with that, totally off subject, and to your whole thief example well the humans and earth are Optimus's family now he even said that Earth is their home and the Decepticons what enslave earth to rebuild Cybertron and Optimus wasnt going to let that happen, and that was Sentinel's goal to use Earth or any other planet for that matter to rebuild Cybertron and Optimus knew that not to mention he killed Ironhide and other Autobots when he defected so Optimus did what he needed to do to save everyone on the planet.
BellHorneKing
BellHorneKing - 7/15/2011, 2:20 PM
It sounds like the kids are defending the Optimus THEY grew up with; a gigantic, murdering dick.

The difference is this; the Optimus from the 80's killed because he HAD TO.

The Optimus from Bayformers kills because he has to, AND he LIKES TO DO IT!
WeakSauceWTF
WeakSauceWTF - 7/17/2011, 2:31 PM
Sounds like your wrong on both accounts...

We all grew up with the same Optimus that beat down Decepticons that tried to take over the Earth. I never saw him enjoy it maybe your thinking of Megatron, actually I think that is who your talking about. That makes a whole lot more sense.

Also sounds like you were determined to hate this movie from the start so you should probably just go troll in your bedroom where trolling belongs.
WeakSauceWTF
WeakSauceWTF - 7/17/2011, 2:31 PM
Sounds like your wrong on both accounts...

We all grew up with the same Optimus that beat down Decepticons that tried to take over the Earth. I never saw him enjoy it maybe your thinking of Megatron, actually I think that is who your talking about. That makes a whole lot more sense.

Also sounds like you were determined to hate this movie from the start so you should probably just go troll in your bedroom where trolling belongs.
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