Netflix Boss Recalls "Fistfight" With Marvel Television Over DEFENDERS TV Shows: "They Wanted To Make Money"

Netflix Boss Recalls "Fistfight" With Marvel Television Over DEFENDERS TV Shows: "They Wanted To Make Money"

Netflix CEO Ted Sarandos has reflected on the streamer's collaboration with Marvel, explaining that while it was "the biggest deal in the history of television," there were some big clashes over quality.

By JoshWilding - Mar 19, 2025 12:03 PM EST
Filed Under: Defenders
Source: Variety

In late 2013, Marvel Television and Netflix announced a groundbreaking deal to bring Daredevil, Jessica Jones, Luke Cage, and Iron Fist to the streaming service, with the plan being for those characters to eventually assemble in The Defenders

While that eventual crossover drew mixed reviews from fans, the shows were largely successful and ran for multiple seasons (Daredevil even spawned a spin-off with The Punisher, a series that ran for two seasons). 

In 2018, Netflix pulled the plug on all those shows in response to Disney launching its own streaming service, Disney+. Marvel Television was also scrapped, with Kevin Feige finally given full control over all things Marvel.

Marvel Television has since been relaunched but is completely separate from the studio once spearheaded by Jeph Loeb under the purview of former Marvel Entertainment Chairman Isaac Perlmutter.

Talking to Variety, Netflix CEO Ted Sarandos reflected on the deal and didn't have many positives to share about his experiences with the previous regime at Marvel Television. 

"By far, our Marvel deal [in 2013] was the biggest deal in the history of television. No one will ever touch it," he explained. "We committed to five original seasons of TV with no pilots, 13 expensive episodes for each show centered around one character. And then a crossover season. Ultimately, we learned a lot about the entertainment business on that deal."

Asked if he believes the MCU TV shows being produced for Disney+ are a success, Sarandos shared, "I think they are. I mean, I don’t know because they don’t release any numbers."

"On our shows, we were dealing with the old Marvel television regime, which operated independently at Disney. And they were thrifty," he admitted. "And every time we wanted to make the shows bigger or better, we had to bang on them. Our incentives were not well aligned. We wanted to make great television; they wanted to make money. I thought we could make money with great television."

"You want to work with people whose incentives are aligned with yours. When people are producing for you, they’re trying to produce as cheaply as possible. My incentive is to make it as great as possible," Sarandos continued. "That’s a lesson that I take forever."

"As producers, whatever [Marvel] didn’t spend, they kept. So every time we wanted to add something to the show to make it better, it was a fistfight," he concluded. 

This isn't overly surprising, especially as Perlmutter was known for being incredibly thrifty and unwilling to spend any more than he deemed necessary. That ultimately played a big role in Marvel Studios President Kevin Feige asking Disney CEO Bob Iger to become a separate entity without the input of Perlmutter or Marvel Entertainment's Creative Committee. 

While there was room for improvement with the Defenders slate of TV shows, they were largely successful and, if nothing else, gave us Daredevil...which has since led to Daredevil: Born Again. It's hard to complain too much about that

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Malatrova15
Malatrova15 - 3/19/2025, 12:15 PM
Ike Is king
DianaGohan
DianaGohan - 3/19/2025, 12:26 PM
@Malatrova15 - Ike Perlmutter [frick]ing sucks and anyone who tries saying otherwise I will smash their face in with a hammer because they have no idea what they're talking about.
DarthOmega
DarthOmega - 3/19/2025, 12:28 PM
@DianaGohan - He was a racist prick. [frick] em
Gambito
Gambito - 3/19/2025, 12:27 PM
Here we go with the evil executive don’t support art narrative is [frick]ing stupid Ike is a goat no matter what they say
Gmoney84
Gmoney84 - 3/19/2025, 12:38 PM
@Gambito - dude, [frick] Ike. He was a cancer.
Goldboink
Goldboink - 3/19/2025, 3:07 PM
@Gambito -
Yes, making money is why the endeavor existed so that is a weak argument. I also think the whole Fountainhead argument is getting old and never had any weight anyway. The people who pay you have expectations that need to be met.

All that said Perlmutter was a small minded, short sighted toy salesman who is both a bigot and mysoginist who had little interest in making the best possible product. Good riddance to bad rubbish is what I say about him.
Matchesz
Matchesz - 3/19/2025, 4:41 PM
@Gambito - Ike and Elon both support Trump, if Ike own a car dealership it would be terrorized too on top of the hate comments lol
0bstreperous
0bstreperous - 3/19/2025, 12:28 PM
Less money and better Daredevil go figure
All the production value in the world and no costume no action
RedFury
RedFury - 3/19/2025, 12:29 PM
It's ironic that he says he wants to make good tv first, and then also make lots of money when Netflix is notorious for paint by the numbers entertainment. They also love to kill shows based on audience numbers, even if it's something the fan base loves, and has good reviews.

Talk about calling the kettle black lol.
Clintthahamster
Clintthahamster - 3/19/2025, 12:34 PM
@RedFury - They are actually actively making TV worse at this point.
https://www.cbr.com/netflix-on-demand-streaming-issue-casual-viewership/
RedFury
RedFury - 3/19/2025, 12:42 PM
@Clintthahamster - oh wow, I didn't know it was getting this bad... It's actually hard to believe that they're making content geared toward listening, and not watching.

How they don't see that this will be the beginning of the end for themselves is beyond me lol. "Hey let's take our platforms entire purpose, and sabotage it until people get sick of us and cancel their subscriptions!"
Clintthahamster
Clintthahamster - 3/19/2025, 1:32 PM
@RedFury -"It's actually hard to believe that they're making content geared toward listening, and not watching."

It honestly makes perfect sense to me. My wife has become someone who listens to shows while playing mobile games. I used to give her shit about it when she'd ask me about something that she'd know if she just looked at the screen, but it stopped being funny after the 30th or 40th time . . .

"How they don't see that this will be the beginning of the end for themselves is beyond me."

They're publicly traded, so it's not about the future. It's never about more than this quarter. They'll only give a shit once share prices start falling.
RedFury
RedFury - 3/19/2025, 2:08 PM
@Clintthahamster - it certainly makes sense from a standpoint of catering to the user and their habits. I'm guilty of scrolling and "watching" as well lol. It just seems to me that as a platform - following this behaviour and building things to fit it is a crack in the armor that's going to grow and grow and eventually shatter.

We humans suck at managing our attention and wants to the point that we walk ourselves off the cliff before we even notice the edge. And Netflix catering to this behaviour in my mind is absolutely going to destroy them in the end.

But to your point, it's a money game and the shareholders matter more than the product. So you're likely right that they'll only notice when it's too late. But the people in charge have already made their money at that point so they likely don't give a hoot.

It's a shame really. It's seems all the good that streaming has brought us, is starting to be outweighed by the negatives.
DarthOmega
DarthOmega - 3/19/2025, 12:32 PM
Bring back Luke and Jessica. Let's give them a second chance like they did with Daredevil and Punisher.
MakeAmericaGrea
MakeAmericaGrea - 3/19/2025, 12:33 PM
@DarthOmega -

That Luke Cage is too nice.

Get a better actor.
DarthOmega
DarthOmega - 3/19/2025, 12:42 PM
@MakeAmericaGrea - Any suggestions?
GodHercules20
GodHercules20 - 3/19/2025, 1:08 PM
@DarthOmega - Trevante Rhodes

User Comment Image
MisterBones
MisterBones - 3/19/2025, 12:41 PM
Says the man that cancels every decent show after 1 season, produces more slop year after year, and approves constant price hikes
ModHaterSLADE
ModHaterSLADE - 3/19/2025, 12:42 PM
Yeah, it started off good, but then you get trash like the first season of Iron Fist.
ARegularCrab
ARegularCrab - 3/19/2025, 12:43 PM
Delusional
TheVisionary25
TheVisionary25 - 3/19/2025, 12:51 PM
Isn’t Netflix notoriously cheap too?.

Anyway , not too surprising that the old Marvel TV regime was like that considering how notoriously thrifty Perlmutter was…

The Netflix shows could have used more money at times , some more then others though I think AOS used its budget the best.
Patient2670
Patient2670 - 3/19/2025, 1:41 PM
@TheVisionary25 - I know it doesn't always show, but Netflix was actually(maybe not anymore) notoriously frivolous with their spending. Massive price tags ooon projects, particularly original feature projects. That was how they got all those people to contract with them, rather than other studios. It's also how the 47 Ronin guy was able to rip them off so badly.
ATrueHero1987
ATrueHero1987 - 3/19/2025, 12:55 PM
All seasons of DD on Netflix are phenomenal. That being said, all the Marvel Netflix shows together are just....good. Some episodes/shows, you can tell they went the cheap route.
Razorface1
Razorface1 - 3/19/2025, 1:01 PM
"Asked if he believes the MCU TV shows being produced for Disney+"

Pal you are missing like half a sentence there
JayLemle
JayLemle - 3/19/2025, 1:19 PM
Perlmutter is a mother-phucking HACK!!! Who remembers him thinking he could kick Iger and Feige out if his choice for the board was elected, LOL? The only things Perlmutter did right was seasons 1 and 2 of Agents of SHIELD, and brought The Defenders together. Past that, Perlmutter can burn in hell.
GeneralZod
GeneralZod - 3/19/2025, 1:43 PM
@JayLemle - Under Perlmutter, MAOS on legacy network TV, Netflix Marvel TV, Phase 1, 2 and 3. Under Permultter-less Feige, Phase 4 and 5, Disney+ Marvel TV.

Did I get that right?

String
String - 3/19/2025, 2:44 PM
The idea the Netflix shows could have been better than they were is sort of disappointing. Especially when we see how poorly they adapted Iron Fist to live-action. That character has a cinematic level origin story and never fit in the Netflix shows outside of being with Luke Cage. Hopefully, when we get Iron Fist, either Danny Rand to give that comics character his rightful due or the new Iron Fist, Lin Lie, it will be superior to what the old Marvel Television, under Jeph Loeb & Ike Perlmutter, gave us.
usclerkguy
usclerkguy - 3/19/2025, 5:35 PM
This(we want to make great TV, they wanted to make money)coming from Sarandos/Netflix who aren't opposed to overpaying ($300million) on crappy movies. Overpaying famous actors and directors doesn't seem to equate to great product

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