Sony Pictures and Digital Domain collaborated on the visual effects for Madame Web, creating a new Marvel Universe inhabited by spectacular new superheroes (and a deadly costumed supervillain).
Digital Domain largely focused on the movie's third act, with their team of Oscar-winning artists recreating the iconic streets of New York City, even though Madame Web was shot on set in Boston. Beyond the movie's environments, the company's VFX artists also created the explosive action sequences which capped off the story.
We recently caught up with VFX Supervisor Scott Edelstein to learn more about Digital Domain's contributions to Sony's latest Marvel movie. That includes intel on the work that went into the elements mentioned above, little details you likely didn't realise were enhanced with VFX, that amazing final shot of Madame Web and her Spider-Women, and the main challenges this project presented.
No stranger to superheroes, Scott has worked on everything from Daredevil to Deadpool, Avengers: Endgame, and Spider-Man: No Way Home. During our conversation, he even reflected on Digital Domain's contributions to the latter, explaining the importance of recreating those iconic characters in a way that did them justice.
You can read the full interview below - our thanks go out to Scott for taking the time to answer these questions with such insightful and fascinating responses!
How familiar were you with Madame Web and its characters before boarding the project and how important do the comics, or even other Marvel films, tend to be when it comes to approaching a movie like this?
I've had the privilege of working on numerous Marvel films during my 24-year tenure at Digital Domain. However, Madame Web was a character I delved deeper into once we became involved with the project. Relating back to the comics became a crucial step for us. This process allowed us to develop visuals that not only aligned with the filmmaker's vision but also honored the character's comic origins. Marvel's rich universe serves as an invaluable resource, guiding us in creating a cohesive and authentic cinematic experience. It's this blend of the filmmaker's vision and the comic's essence that truly brings these characters to life on the big screen.
Concept art recently went viral showing Spider-Man battling Ezekiel. Working on a project like this, do you find a lot of changes take place during production or was the movie a little further along by the time you and your team worked on it?
I actually got involved in this particular project quite early on during the previs phase. However, by that point, the production had been underway for some time, likely with many story refinements already in place. In the dynamic world of comic book-based superhero movies, changes are quite common throughout production. These alterations can stem from a variety of factors, including ongoing script development, creative insights from the team, and even audience feedback. Our role as visual effects artists is to be agile and adaptable, ensuring that we can seamlessly integrate these changes into the evolving narrative while maintaining the integrity of the project's vision.
In the warehouse, you have a lot of fireworks going off in the background as Ezekiel hunts down the movie's leads - how difficult is it to build a sequence like that in terms of merging those effects with the on-camera action?
It's all about meticulous planning! As any VFX artist will attest, the more we can capture in-camera, the more seamless our final product becomes. For this particular sequence, we collaborated closely with the Special Effects (SPFX) team and the Director of Photography (DP) on set. Together, we ensured that we had an array of practical fireworks, explosions, and interactive lighting happening at safe distances behind the actors.
This strategic approach not only enhanced the realism of the scene but also made our VFX work more efficient. We were able to use these practical elements as reference points, allowing us to layer in new, larger, and more complex effects where it would have been too risky for even a seasoned stunt performer. There are moments in the sequence where the fireworks interact directly with the actors or explosions propel someone across the room.
Much credit goes to the incredible stunt team, who fearlessly performed many of these actions themselves. For this portion of the film, our VFX team stepped in to seamlessly enhance the spectacle. It's this blend of practical effects with CGI that creates a truly impactful and immersive experience for the audience.
In terms of recreating New York and the Pepsi sign for the battle with Ezekiel on the rooftop, what did that process entail for Digital Domain?
Our process began with a real-life rooftop in Boston, serving as our primary reference point. We scanned and extensively photographed this location, using it as the foundation for our rooftop setting. Alongside, we captured the surrounding docks, river, and shipyard to enrich our digital environment.
The next step involved integrating the iconic New York City skyline and the unmistakable Pepsi-Cola sign. We meticulously reconstructed the rooftop, sign, and nearby buildings in 3D to ensure accuracy across a range of camera angles.
While the rooftop and its immediate surroundings were fully realized in 3D, we employed a 2.5D approach for elements beyond the river. This technique blended depth with 2D elements, creating a convincing cityscape that extended the scene's scope.
During the live-action shoot, a large section of the rooftop set was constructed outdoors. For these sequences, Digital Domain executed extensive set extensions, seamlessly blending practical and digital elements. In scenes requiring dynamic action or intricate lighting interactions with CG explosions or fire, we’d extract the actors from the live-action footage and integrate them into our CG environment, resulting in a seamless and immersive rooftop battle with Ezekiel.
It sounds like a lot of your work involved recreating real-life locations; do you tend to visit those yourself for reference material to ensure accuracy or is there another approach you take?
Our approach to capturing real-life locations for reference material varies based on factors such as location availability, project schedule, and complexity. Ideally, if there is a real-world location that serves as the basis for our CG work, visiting it ourselves is invaluable. Being on-site allows us to capture extensive reference material, which we later use to recreate elements in 3D or integrate them directly into our compositions. This level of detail ensures a high degree of accuracy and authenticity in our visual effects. However, due to logistical constraints, it's not always feasible to physically travel to every location. In these cases, we employ a range of techniques to achieve the desired result. This might involve using existing reference materials, such as photos and videos, collaborating closely with location scouts, or even utilizing satellite imagery. The goal is always the same: to create visual effects that seamlessly blend with the real world, enhancing the cinematic experience for the audience.
I noticed in the VFX breakdown that, as well as the environment, Digital Domain added lenses to some of the Spider-Women's masks. What are the challenges with a smaller, yet still very important, effect like that?
The costumes indeed had physical lenses that the actors could wear. However, safety was a primary concern, as these lenses often obstructed or limited the actors' vision. This issue was particularly pronounced for the stunt team, who faced challenges wearing the lenses during intricate stunts or fight sequences. This is where VFX plays a crucial role.
We had the advantage of extensive references from scans, photography, and scenes where the actors did wear practical lenses. However, seamlessly adding a CG element right over an actor's eyes is no small feat. One of the primary challenges is preserving the intricate details of the actors' performances. We strive to maintain the authenticity of their expressions and emotions while enhancing the visual impact. Finding the balance between realism and practicality is key. Additionally, ensuring that the CG lenses interact convincingly with lighting, reflections, and the natural movements of the actors adds another layer of complexity. Our goal is always to create a seamless integration that enhances the character's presence without distracting from the performance.
Can you take us through your approach to that awesome final shot of Madame Web and the three Spider-Women as they watch over the city?
Absolutely! That final shot was one of those electrifying moments that came together beautifully as a late addition. The plate featuring the Spider-Women was already captured, and our task was to seamlessly place them onto a rooftop in the heart of NYC.
We began with concept exploration to envision the background and how it would fit with the foreground plate of the girls. Once we settled on the vision, our environments team crafted the NYC skyline from scratch, drawing upon various references for accuracy. The result was a blend of practical and digital elements, with the vibrant skyline serving as a majestic backdrop to the Spider-Women's watchful presence over the city.
In contrast, Spider-Man: No Way Home featured three Spider-Men. Looking back at that project, what were the biggest challenges in bringing each of those characters to life given their different costumes and movements?
Ah, Spider-Man: No Way Home, those were the days! Each Spider-Man in the film had their distinct personality and movement style, however, Digital Domain focused solely on handling the variations of Tom Holland's Spider-Man for this film. That said, beyond the Spider-Men, we had a whole host of iconic characters like Doc Ock, Green Goblin, Electro, Sandman, and more, each with their own nuances.
Digital doubles played a significant role in No Way Home, especially with the varied movements and actions required for each character. The biggest challenge, I'd say, was capturing the essence of each character as portrayed by the actors. Whether it was Spider-Man's agility, Green Goblin's menacing presence, or Doc Ock's calculated movements, staying true to their unique traits was paramount. This meant not only focusing on the realistic movement of their costumes but also on the subtleties of their performances.
Incorporating the actors' nuances into the digital double was just as crucial as ensuring the cloth physics moved convincingly. It was this attention to detail that brought each character to life in a way that fans could truly connect with.
Back to Madame Web, what was the biggest challenge working on the movie and what about the experience did you most enjoy?
I believe the biggest challenge for Digital Domain's work on Madame Web was the rooftop sequence. This particular scene involved a lengthy fight sequence where we had to create the rooftop in various states of destruction. From fire and explosions to fireworks lighting up the sky and set, culminating in a dramatic collapse into the water below—it was quite the spectacle.
Our task was to make it all feel real and immersive, ensuring that the audience felt the danger and was fully immersed in the world of the film. The complexity of blending real actors with digital doubles, all while maintaining a sense of realism, was both challenging and exhilarating.
As always, the most enjoyable aspect of any project is the collaboration with my team. Digital Domain assembled an exceptional crew for Madame Web, and every member brought their A-game. It's a joy to create art together every day. Furthermore, working closely with the client team was a real pleasure. Getting to know everyone and collaborating to create something truly special was a rewarding experience. In the end, it's these relationships and the shared passion for our craft that make each project so fulfilling.
Madame Web is now available to buy or rent online.