George R.R. Martin Spoils HOUSE OF THE DRAGON Season 3 Death In Since-Deleted Post; HBO Responds

George R.R. Martin Spoils HOUSE OF THE DRAGON Season 3 Death In Since-Deleted Post; HBO Responds

George R.R. Martin has followed up on last week's post by outlining his biggest issues with season 2 of House of the Dragon, spoiling a pretty significant season 3 death in the process...

By MarkCassidy - Sep 04, 2024 07:09 PM EST
Filed Under: Game of Thrones
Source: Via SFF Gazette

Last week, George R.R. Martin took to his “Not a Blog” to hint at some significant grievances with the recent sophomore season of HBO's Game of Thrones prequel series, House of the Dragon, promising to go into more detail soon. 

The writer has now done just that, with a lengthy post outlining why he felt one particular character omission in the season premiere could have a "butterfly effect" on later seasons of the show.

He also spoils a significant season 3 death - at least for those who haven't read the book.

In the show, King Aegon and Queen Helaena have two children (Jaehaerys and Jaehaera), but in Martin's Fire and Blood, the twins have a younger brother, 2-year-old Maelor. The infamous “Blood and Cheese” sequence in the series shows the hired thugs kill Jaehaerys in front of his mother, but the events of the book are quite different - and a lot more disturbing.

“I argued against it, for all these reasons,” Martin writes. “I did not argue long, or with much heat, however. The change weakened the sequence, I felt, but only a bit. And Ryan had what seemed to be practical reasons for it; they did not want to deal with casting another child, especially a two-year old toddler. Kids that young will inevitably slow down production, and there would be budget implications. Budget was already an issue on HOUSE OF THE DRAGON, it made sense to save money wherever we could. Moreover, Ryan assured me that we were not losing Prince Maelor, simply postponing him. Queen Helaena could still give birth to him in season three, presumably after getting with child late in season two. That made sense to me, so I withdrew my objections and acquiesced to the change.”

But, Martin adds, “Sometime between the initial decision to remove Maelor, a big change was made. The prince’s birth was no longer just going to be pushed back to season 3. He was never going to be born at all. The younger son of Aegon and Helaena would never appear.”

Martin goes on to mention some other changes that might have to me made going forward, and warns: “And there are larger and more toxic butterflies to come, if HOUSE OF THE DRAGON goes ahead with some of the changes being contemplated for seasons 3 and 4…”

He then notes that, in showrunner Ryan Condol's treatment for season 3, Helaena takes her own life - as she does in the book after Maelor's death later in the story - but here it's "for no particular reason," since Maelor doesn't exist in the HBO adaptation.

HBO responded to the post with the following statement:

“There are few greater fans of George R.R. Martin and his book Fire & Blood than the creative team on House of the Dragon, both in production and at HBO. Commonly, when adapting a book for the screen, with its own format and limitations, the showrunner ultimately is required to make difficult choices about the characters and stories the audience will follow. We believe that Ryan Condal and his team have done an extraordinary job and the millions of fans the series has amassed over the first two seasons will continue to enjoy it.”

Martin has since deleted his post, but you can still read it here. What do you make of his comments? Let us know in the usual place.

"The prequel series finds the Targaryen dynasty at the absolute apex of its power, with more than 15 dragons under their yoke. Most empires—real and imagined—crumble from such heights. In the case of the Targaryens, their slow fall begins almost 193 years before the events of Game of Thrones, when King Viserys Targaryen breaks with a century of tradition by naming his daughter Rhaenyra heir to the Iron Throne. But when Viserys later fathers a son, the court is shocked when Rhaenyra retains her status as his heir, and seeds of division sow friction across the realm."

House of the Dragon season 2 sees Matt Smith, Olivia Cooke, Emma D’Arcy, Eve Best, Steve Toussaint, Fabien Frankel, Ewan Mitchell, Tom Glynn-Carney, Sonoya Mizuno, and Rhys Ifans reprise their respective roles. Additional returning cast includes Harry Collett, Bethany Antonia, Phoebe Campbell, Phia Saban, Jefferson Hall, and Matthew Needham.

The directors for the new season are Alan Taylor (Episodes 1 & 4), Clare Kilner (Episodes 2 & 5), Geeta Patel (Episodes 3 & 8), Andrij Parekh (Episode 6), and Loni Peristere (Episode 7).

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CoHost
CoHost - 9/4/2024, 7:45 PM
He's such a baby.
thewanderer
thewanderer - 9/4/2024, 7:54 PM
@CoHost - don’t sell the rights to your work if you don’t want it changed.
Malatrova15
Malatrova15 - 9/4/2024, 8:49 PM
@thewanderer - he should buy another yatch to feel better and get his ass back to write those books before Kamala's third term.
McMurdo
McMurdo - 9/4/2024, 11:51 PM
@CoHost - he's 100% on point and you're simply out of touch. Read a book, kid.
rebellion
rebellion - 9/5/2024, 12:07 AM
@McMurdo - he isnt. He thinks his F&B booknos better than it really is. He wrote it as a history book and the main story, which is standard prose, he wont finish. And he always expects others to to do his work for him. He is an idiot.
McMurdo
McMurdo - 9/5/2024, 12:10 AM
@rebellion - yes and the Silmarillion is also hot garbage. Spare us!
rebellion
rebellion - 9/5/2024, 2:06 AM
@McMurdo - apples qnd oranges. You think you did something by... bringing up an unrelated work of art? Cool. Also silmarillion is finished. And the trilogy is finished. And the hobbit was finished. ASOIAF isnt. Dunk and egg novels arent finished. F&B still has another volume that needs to be written. Get that frontal lobe checked, its not working like it should.
DocSpock
DocSpock - 9/4/2024, 7:51 PM

Fat dickhead dork.
Malatrova15
Malatrova15 - 9/4/2024, 8:52 PM
@DocSpock - "there's an image"
HashTagSwagg
HashTagSwagg - 9/4/2024, 7:59 PM
So we got another D&D / rings of power situation were the writers think they can write the novel that Tolkien never could.
Toonstrack
Toonstrack - 9/4/2024, 8:12 PM
@HashTagSwagg - sounds like you're seeing whatever you wanna see rather than what's there
McMurdo
McMurdo - 9/4/2024, 11:54 PM
@Toonstrack - no he's right. And Martin is completely on point with the entirety of that blogspot. The changes they made to Maelor have large impacting consequences going into next season and the show and its characters will be worse for it. Especially Healena. once again you're off the mark on "what's there".
Malatrova15
Malatrova15 - 9/4/2024, 7:59 PM
I wish he was this vocal about Got later seasons
harryba11zack
harryba11zack - 9/4/2024, 8:10 PM
phuck the show's writing team, they had no excuse for what they did with the show. this book was done, finished, completed, all they had to do was to stay true to the source material.
User Comment Image
Malatrova15
Malatrova15 - 9/4/2024, 8:23 PM
@harryba11zack - it was barely a book ...they were working whit a novela size wikipedia article....but yes frick them and their non scripted hot lesbian french kiss action. ..i hate to fap in mid family night tv session
harryba11zack
harryba11zack - 9/4/2024, 8:30 PM
@Malatrova15 - the show just become a series of misunderstandings which completely robbed the characters of their agency.
CreateNowSlpL8r
CreateNowSlpL8r - 9/4/2024, 8:40 PM
I wonder what George's actual deal with them is. Did he sell of all the GoT rights from the begining. If so they can do whatever they want with it and the fans can decide. Kind of like Spidey. Sony can shit out tons of terrible Spidey flicks and Marvel can do nothing.

I guess I though maybe they had a deal for one show, so he would negotiate more producer/approval influence in a new deal for spin offs.
Malatrova15
Malatrova15 - 9/4/2024, 8:46 PM
@CreateNowSlpL8r - i literally dont care for what deal he made ..i wish he coul shut about this fanfic series and get his ass to write the god damn books before he eats one too many McBurgers.
CreateNowSlpL8r
CreateNowSlpL8r - 9/4/2024, 9:12 PM
@Malatrova15 - Hes not finishing those books.

I have a feeling his ending was a lot closer to what D&D and now he doesn't know what to do.
LSHF
LSHF - 9/4/2024, 9:09 PM
It just goes to show...
asherman93
asherman93 - 9/4/2024, 9:45 PM
...didn't HBO cut the budget for this season JUST as they were about to start shooting?
Maybe that could explain some of the issues - not so much creative incompetence as getting [frick]ed over by outside factors.
ImNotaBot
ImNotaBot - 9/4/2024, 10:18 PM
I don't get why people hate Martin soo much. I'm sure that if Tolkien was alive he would have something to say about the LOTR movies and specially Rings of Power. Writing a book is way different than writing a comic book, Martin is stalling his books because he knows how big his body of work has become and i'm sure hes afraid of releasing some pice of crap ASOIAF is his child and after he dies he will be know foverer for this universe just like Tokien is know for LOTR.

Martin is mad because this universe is his life and for sure he'll have more things to get mad in the future. I just hope he manage to finish his work in a way that he can die in peace knowing that he did his best.

I love ASOIAF and i think is one of the best fictional universes ever created, alonside LOTR and Dune. If Martin died without finishing his books, i would be fine, for real. He already created soo many stories in this universe, soo many mysteries and is such an amazing fictional world. And i hope he find write a story set in Yi Ti, that would be awesome.
TheLight
TheLight - 9/4/2024, 11:20 PM
@ImNotaBot - "I don't get why people hate Martin soo much. I'm sure that if Tolkien was alive he would have something to say about the LOTR movies and specially Rings of Power. Writing a book is way different than writing a comic book, Martin is stalling his books because he knows how big his body of work has become and i'm sure hes afraid of releasing some pice of crap ASOIAF is his child and after he dies he will be know foverer for this universe just like Tokien is know for LOTR."


It's not that people hate him. People are exasperated with him. He's had years, YEARS to finish his ASOIAF saga and instead of finishing it to give it a proper conclusion and to give the series adaptation more conclusive structure, he got comfortable with the profits. Guaranteed he was probably hoping that as the show got more popular it would do for him he couldn't do with the rest of the books. Finish them. He even most likely gave some cliff notes for dnd to follow that he had initially as ideas for TWOW and ADOS to be a basis. But he underestimated just how lackluster of writers and creators those duds were without source material. And it cost him "his child".

Now the curse continues in the hands of Ryan "simp for Rhaenyra can do no wrong" Condal.

All he had to do was finish his story either before getting it greenlit for a series or finish up TWOW and ADOS during the earlier seasons. Hell, he even had time to do some significant writing in the two years for GOT S8. And he did NOTHING.

Yes writing at times isn't easy. Yes, sometimes things become bigger than you plan, but you still make a plan for contingency. And yes, even his age plays a factor. The man peaked late in his life due to this world he created. But it's no excuse to back away and let others run your work into the ground. George Lucas has learned this the hard way. Now GRRM has joined the club. His answer to all of it is running into the Targ train. He's not honoring or respecting the fans that have followed him for years that have been reading the books since the 90s and have made him rich supporting him. If he can't do it, then maybe he should get people he trusts to help him to finish it. But people have a right to feel a bit peeved that he's whining about how his work is being changed when he himself hasn't even finished the books.
Polaris
Polaris - 9/4/2024, 11:46 PM
@TheLight - If he didn't care about his readers or the quality of his work, I'm sure we would have gotten the last two books years ago. I get why people are pissed at him, I was too before, but I get it. I'm sure he feels terrible about not being able to finish his magnum opus (he's talked about feeling angry and defeated) so right now it just makes me sad tbh. But this story is finished and they're making changes anyway, they're not listening to him and even telling him a character will be introduced later when it won't happen. I can only imagine how frustrating that is for him. I'd like to read his thoughts about GoT's ending as well, but maybe he felt he had no right to complain then because the books aren't written. This time is not his fault tho, so he can vent all he wants.
TheLight
TheLight - 9/4/2024, 11:57 PM
@Polaris - "If he didn't care about his readers or the quality of his work, I'm sure we would have gotten the last two books years ago."

Don't you mean if he DID care?


"This time is not his fault tho, so he can vent all he wants."


Not sure about that 1st part, but if he can vent as you directly point out, so can the fans.


I do agree about them not listening to him with regard to HOTD. He put trust in Condal and Condal did some dnd 2.0 level ups in S2.

Polaris
Polaris - 9/5/2024, 12:16 AM
@TheLight - No. He keeps writing and rewriting because he's not happy with the results. He cares a lot about quality, maybe too much, to the point that he wishes he could go back and edit his published books. He could do what D&D did, wrap it all up quickly even if things don't make sense, but he wants it to be good and he feels like he can't do it (he's talked about getting depressed thinking he has no talent anymore etc).

Yeah, the fans can vent too. I get the frustration. But I don't think is fair to call him lazy or to want him to do nothing except write the books. The man leaves the house to watch a movie and there's people saying he should be writing... that's not how creativity works.
ImNotaBot
ImNotaBot - 9/5/2024, 9:46 PM
@TheLight - Writing a book is a thing you can rush. George lives in a world were he knows he can be the next Tolkien and that is a heavy toll to carry. Like @Polaris said, ASOIAF is his magnum opus, am i'm sure the ending of the show significantly slowed down his writing and he made some changes after seeing fan reactions.

I do think he cares about the fans because he constantly updates fans about what is happening, he answers questions about the book universe and he releases books about other tales while he writes ASOIAF. Remember that the main books are writed by multi-characters points of view and that is a hard thing to write, you can watch George giving interviews and talking about how hard it is to make this work and imagine how hard can be to finish a book like this, of course he's taking his time because he needs to tie all the knots.

Also he took his time writing Dance of the Dragons because he wanted to expand the Targaryen history and he stated several times how much he loves writing them. George does carry a lot about his universe and i'm sure he wants to end his magnum opus in a way that he can die in peace on day knowing that he did his best. Just be pacient and wait.
TheLight
TheLight - 9/6/2024, 9:26 AM
@ImNotaBot - "Also he took his time writing Dance of the Dragons because he wanted to expand the Targaryen history and he stated several times how much he loves writing them. George does carry a lot about his universe and i'm sure he wants to end his magnum opus in a way that he can die in peace on day knowing that he did his best. Just be pacient and wait."


And that's his problem. He took time to continue expanding on the Targs just to avoid continuing his work on TWOW. Chances are to justify whatever he has planned to what TWOW will reveal. But he had TIME to finish this years ago. Also I'm aware that writing can't be rushed. But that is no excuse. While GOT was gaining traction, he could've been working on contingencies. He should've planned out things more accordingly, espectially when he saw that the show was getting ahead of him. He was simply reveling in the profits. No blame to him at all as any of us would too, but it made him feel too safe and now he's in this pit that the rest of us followed him in.

I've been patient for years. I've waited for years. Should I continue to be so after my great great grandkids are born?
Ojeet78
Ojeet78 - 9/4/2024, 10:19 PM
If I were GRRM I wouldn't get so hung up over this minutiae , given how the song of ice and fire ends.
Skestra
Skestra - 9/4/2024, 10:59 PM
If it doesn't involve "The Winds of Winter", George can shut up!
Polaris
Polaris - 9/4/2024, 11:34 PM
I'm glad he's not staying quiet about what bothers him this time. This is his story, his characters, his life work. He has the right to complain, even more since this story is complete. I'm sure he wants to finish the main saga even more than we do, but he's stuck for whatever reason (I think pressure and perfectionism are to blame for his writer's block, and he's not getting younger) and maybe because of that these changes piss him off more, because Condal and Hess have no excuse. They only have to follow the book and his advice, and Condal went and lied to him about Maelor... not cool.
McMurdo
McMurdo - 9/5/2024, 12:00 AM
@Polaris - well stated. Agreed.
grif
grif - 9/5/2024, 11:40 AM
dudes getting paid like a mother [frick]er. wtf?
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