Exploring The BATMAN/SUPERMAN Dynamic w/Michael Uslan, Greg Pak, Mark Waid & More

Exploring The BATMAN/SUPERMAN Dynamic w/Michael Uslan, Greg Pak, Mark Waid & More

With the ever-growing interest in Batman v Superman, we explore the dynamic between these two characters via interviews with, among others, Michael Uslan, Greg Pak, Mark Waid, Kevin Conroy, Tim Daly, Kevin J. Anderson, Alan Burnett and Jay Oliva.

By EdGross - Dec 15, 2014 07:12 AM EST
Filed Under: Batman vs. Superman
Source: Voices From Krypton.net
When Marvel’s The Avengers went on to become the third highest grossing film of all time, Warner Bros. had the expected response of proclaiming their determination to get a Justice League film into production as soon as possible. To many this seemed a foolish and imitative attempt to rake in Avengers-like money without putting in the kind of groundwork that Marvel did in establishing its cinematic universe. Many argued that what WB should do, instead, was a film featuring the one thing that Marvel did not have: a team-up of their two most iconic characters, Superman and Batman. In the end, of course, that’s exactly what’s happening with the sequel to Man of Steel bringing together Henry Cavill’s Superman with Ben Affleck’s Batman. And while a direct sequel to the first film would have been preferable, there’s a genuine sense of excitement about seeing these two characters appearing together in a live action adventure for the first time. Superman and Batman coming together, of course, is nothing new in other mediums.
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"We start at the beginning, and the beginning is New York World's Fair Comics, 1940 edition, and the cover of that which was the first one that showed Superman and Batman in a scene together," enthuses Michael Uslan, emphasizing that he's speaking as a comics historian and fanboy and not as the producer of every Batman film since Tim Burton's 1989 effort. "These are two characters who might, at first blush, look very similar, but are in fact very different. When Bob Kane and Bill Finger created Batman, the idea was, 'Okay, Superman's the first superhero who's incredibly popular, sales are beginning to skyrocket, we gotta create the second superhero, so let's go in the opposite direction. Let's create someone who's human. A superhero with no superpowers.' There's the divide. "The second part of it," he continues, "is that Superman is an alien, he comes from another planet. He has been sometimes perceived or portrayed as almost messiah-like with the degree of his powers. Batman is an everyman. He is the figure that I fell in love with as a superhero more so than Superman, the Hulk or any of them, because he was human. And because that identification was so strong, and I did believe when I was eight that if I studied hard, worked out hard and my dad bought me a cool car, I could be this guy. It's that identification that's really strong and helps Batman in his other media appearances cross borders and cultures."

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Superman and Batman began to crossover with each other on the Man of Steel's radio show in the 1950s, sharing adventures in the pages of World's Finest for decades, both being members of the Justice League in print, animation and video games; and both the stars of Greg Pak’s run on the Batman/Superman comic. It seems that they remain, even after all of these years, an endlessly fascinating combination of personalities who, on the surface, couldn’t seem more different from each other, yet are united on so many fronts. “The list of qualities that keep the two characters diametrically opposed is huge,” offers writer Mark Waid, a veteran of Justice League, Superman: Birthright and Kingdom Come, among many others. “Batman was born from a moment of rage and grief and helplessness. Superman was born from tragedy as well — but a very emotionally removed tragedy, and one that was ultimately about hope and promise and about the continuance of life. Both characters have secret identities and wear masks, but Bruce Wayne’s mask is Batman while Superman’s mask is Clark Kent. One’s posing as something superhuman while the other is pretending to be absolutely normal. While Batman is all about fear and intimidation, Superman is a very relaxed, open, friendly figure — he deliberately doesn’t wear a mask, because he knows he has to earn people’s trust and when you’re impervious to harm, there’s no reason not to be relaxed in your movements and body language.

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“But what draws them together,” he adds, “is a mutual thirst for justice and fairness. Batman is, in his heart of hearts, always trying to make sure that what happened to him as a boy never happens to anyone else; Superman was raised with a phenomenal respect for human life and is as vulnerable as anyone when it comes to striking at him through his heart and compassion.” Actor Kevin Conroy, who has been voicing the Dark Knight on and off since the 1992 premiere of Batman: The Animated Series, has his own views on the character dynamics between Batman and Superman. “Batman’s isolation and his singularity, his inability to really let other people into his personal world, is really essential to the character,” Conroy muses. “It’s part of what audiences expect. Even in a series like Justice League, where he was one of seven superheroes, Batman was always the odd man out. The others would go off as a group to do something — you know, they might go have pizza — and Batman was always the guy left back in the cave. So in these stories in which he is teamed with Superman, I think it’s the closest Batman gets to have a brother, a kindred spirit. Superman understands Batman. He understands his need to be alone and his isolation. He’s probably the only one of all the superheroes who can balance Batman in terms of wit and power, so they’re a very good balance for each other.”

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As to what it is that Batman sees in Superman as a person, he reflects, “I think Batman thinks of Superman as the Dudley Do-Right of superheroes. He admires his strength and his character, but he also thinks he’s incredibly naïve and very unsophisticated about the world. Remember, Batman is also Bruce Wayne, so he’s very urbane. He’s very versed in the way of the world. And Superman is Clark Kent. That’s where I think the distinction is. Batman just thinks that Superman is kind of a very, very naïve guy who always sees the goodness in everybody. And Batman tends to see the darkness.” “I think Superman likes Batman,” interjects actor Tim Daly, who voiced the character in Superman: The Animated Series and has worked with Conroy as Batman numerous times over the years. “In his own private way, he gets a kick out of the fact that he can count on Batman being cynical and pessimistic, and that he sort of relies on that probably in the way you rely on certain friends or family members to do certain things that you shake your head at and go, ‘Oh, jeez.’ It’s sort of comforting. He’s come to trust Batman to have his back. And he has a genuine concern for him.”

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Author Kevin J. Anderson, who wrote the Superman/Batman novel Enemies & Allies, feels that those two characters together make something akin to a bromance novel. "In every romance novel," he poses, "the team has to hate each other at first, they fight, and they finally figure out that they were meant to be together. It's almost like that with Batman and Superman. They are always fighting and arguing and resisting each other's efforts to do something, because they're pretty set in their ways. Kal-El does not want to beat up the bad guys, he just wants to take them to jail. Batman, of course, says, 'If they get bruised because they were trying to mug somebody, then they asked for it.' It's just a different attitude they have. It's interesting to have the two of them together, because it allows you to compare and contrast."

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JoeMomma29
JoeMomma29 - 12/15/2014, 7:35 AM
It will be history when we see Superman and Batman on the big screen together for the first time!
fahQman
fahQman - 12/15/2014, 7:45 AM
You have blocked this comment, or it has been reported by the CBM community for abusive content - View Comment?
DrKinsolving
DrKinsolving - 12/15/2014, 7:52 AM
Can't wait for Batman v Superman.

I love this monologue from Kill Bill too, haha

JoeMomma29
JoeMomma29 - 12/15/2014, 7:52 AM
@nighteagle

Dude do not even engage that guy, he will just report you for tolling or being a bully. It is a no win situation when you address him.
Pasto
Pasto - 12/15/2014, 7:53 AM
Nicely done Ed.
MarkV
MarkV - 12/15/2014, 7:54 AM
It's going to be crazy to see them on screen together.

Gotta admit to being stoked.

I always felt like Superman and Batman really understood each other much better than the other characters. Maybe because they are both orphans.
RyKnow
RyKnow - 12/15/2014, 7:55 AM
Whether the upcoming film will be any good remains open to debate. Will Snyder learn his lesson's from Man of Steel. The story should be tighter with Chris Terrio involved. Argo was brilliant.
slickrickdesigns
slickrickdesigns - 12/15/2014, 8:01 AM

knocturnalzen10
knocturnalzen10 - 12/15/2014, 8:06 AM
this will be epic I hope the other characters don't take away from the interaction .................... marvel fans pray whedon stays otherwise you're f****** .............. thank you
JoeMomma29
JoeMomma29 - 12/15/2014, 8:07 AM
@nighteagle

He actually reminds me of a high school bully just hanging around to see what buttons he an push to make you break. Of course anyone can be brace behind a keypad..........
EdGross
EdGross - 12/15/2014, 8:08 AM
Thanks all. Glad you enjoyed the piece.
mbembet
mbembet - 12/15/2014, 8:10 AM
i can't wait to see ben affleck kicks the crap out of man of shit!
sKeemAn
sKeemAn - 12/15/2014, 8:12 AM
Great read and write-up. Bats & Supes totally have a bromance. When they finally grace the screen together, it will be history and epic.
Desrow
Desrow - 12/15/2014, 8:16 AM
Sumitsjc
Sumitsjc - 12/15/2014, 8:17 AM
Great write-up.
Sumitsjc
Sumitsjc - 12/15/2014, 8:20 AM
@Desrow
Ha ha... That's funny 😁
supes123
supes123 - 12/15/2014, 8:25 AM
@Desrow

hahah thats great..You know whats funny, Mark Ruffalo hates on Ben affleck becasue he claims affleck ended the friendship between him and gardner
Jordanstine
Jordanstine - 12/15/2014, 8:31 AM
I don't know what's worse:

Marvel vs DC trolls

Or

PS4 vs XB1 trolls

I can understand some of the dumb reasoning behind Console wars (avg person can only afford one; but I just get both and just worry about games to get for what system).

But Movies are a win-win for us all! If you wanna see it, have a blast! If you don't, no ones forcing you to see it. Why hate on the other?
JoeMomma29
JoeMomma29 - 12/15/2014, 8:38 AM
@Jordanstine

LMAO! I have said the same thing that the only thing worse than the Marvel . DC wars is the game console wars.

I do the same thing I buy all the consoles because I enjoy what those consoles bring to the table even the Wii U (Sony and Fox).
MightyZeus
MightyZeus - 12/15/2014, 8:50 AM
I'm really looking forward to seeing Bruce and Clark's friendship in the movie. I don't really care about these two iconic heroes fighting against each other, i care about these two working together.

It's going to be one of those memorable comic book movie moments when we finally see Batman and Superman together on the big screen.
foolonthehill
foolonthehill - 12/15/2014, 10:47 AM
Nailing it with these articles, Ed! Great work!
dnno1
dnno1 - 12/15/2014, 10:54 AM
...As we look ahead, we have much
to be excited about. This year we will
introduce such promising shows as The
Leftovers, from Lost co-creator Damon
Lindelof, on HBO and produced by
Warner Bros.; and The Last Ship, from
blockbuster producer Michael Bay,
on TNT. Warner Bros. has an exciting
lineup of films for the next few years,
including the final Hobbit installment,
which comes out later in 2014, and
a new film series written by J.K. Rowling that will
introduce additional characters from the magical
realm of Harry Potter, as well as a sequel to the hugely
popular The LEGO Movie. We’re also excited about
the forthcoming follow-up to Man of Steel featuring
Superman and Batman, which is scheduled for release
in 2016.
In television we’re also digging deeper into
the rich DC Entertainment library, with programs such
as Gotham and The Flash following on the success
of Arrow...

-- Jeff Bewkes, Chairman and CEO of Time Warner
(taken from his message in the 2013 Annual Report)


A follow-up to a film is by definition a sequel, guys. "Batman vs. Superman" is the Man of Steel sequel. A lot of us are going by this false impression that this is not part of a series of films, but that is a farce. This is all part of a series of films under the Man of Steel/Superman brand that will eventually lead into spinoff films.
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