JUSTICE LEAGUE Star Ray Fisher Says Joss Whedon Wanted Cyborg To Be Drawn And Quartered By Steppenwolf

JUSTICE LEAGUE Star Ray Fisher Says Joss Whedon Wanted Cyborg To Be Drawn And Quartered By Steppenwolf

Justice League's Ray Fisher has talked more about his experience working with Joss Whedon, explaining that he had to fight the filmmaker over an ableist joke with Cyborg saying he couldn't feel his legs.

By JoshWilding - Apr 12, 2021 06:04 AM EST
Filed Under: Justice League
Source: Empire Online

Zack Snyder's Justice League star Ray Fisher is finally breaking his silence on what happened during Joss Whedon's reshoots, and he recently spoke with Empire to shed even more light on his experiences with the filmmaker.

While the full interview will be published in the next issue, the magazine's website has shared some excerpts, with the actor addressing what he saw as a lack of transparency at the time. 

"Transparency would have gone a long way; if they had said to us, ‘Hey, we don’t like Zack’s movie, we want to shift gears completely and we need you guys to buckle down,’" Fisher says, reflecting on the troubled reshoots in 2017. "But they were trying to hold on to this narrative of doing it for Zack and maintaining his vision, all the while completely not doing that."

"Unfortunately, gaslighting occurred by asking for input but, ultimately, biting people’s heads off when you gave it," he said, alluding to the negative experience he had working with Whedon. 

Fisher added to that by making more damning allegations against The Avengers director, claiming they butted heads over an ableist joke about Victor being unable to feel his legs, while Whedon also wanted to shoot a scene with Cyborg being drawn and quartered by Steppenwolf. Ultimately, this became the scene with the villain simply tearing off the hero's leg. 

"Had I not been so welcomed in the initial process I might not have felt as comfortable speaking up about those circumstances," he explains. "But I had to try to rein those guys in. It was not a good look to essentially pull this Black man, who has already endured so much physical trauma, limb from limb."

Fisher has apparently watched the Snyder Cut of Justice League SEVEN times since it was released on HBO Max, and is understandably much happier with how Cyborg is portrayed there. 


Click on the "Next" button below to check out a ranking of our
favourite new characters in Zack Snyder's Justice League!

10. Vulko

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We don't agree with much Joss Whedon did in his 2017 cut of Justice League, but leaving Willem Dafoe's Vulko on the cutting room floor may not have been the worst idea in the world.

Aside from nagging Arthur Curry about taking his rightful place in Atlantis by wielding his mother's trident, there's not a lot the character brings to the Snyder Cut. Well, beyond being someone who has clearly spent years trying to get Aquaman to do what he believes to be the right thing. 

This Vulko just isn't overly likeable, and James Wan's take on him definitely resonated more with us. That was by no means a reinvention, though, and this version serves his purpose well.
 

9. Desaad

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A completely new character added to the Snyder Cut of Justice League, Desaad clearly takes great delight in serving as the right-hand of Darkseid. Throughout the course of this movie, we see him revel in belittling Steppenwolf, and we can't help but hate him as a result.

That's not to say Steppenwolf is a sympathetic character, but Desaad is a typical, hateful lacky...and that's why he doesn't rank any higher than this! However, we were definitely left wanting more.

Clearly, he was going to be at Darkseid's side when the invasion of Earth began, and that likely means he'd have crossed paths with the League. He doesn't seem to be much of a fighter, but something tells us Snyder definitely had plans to do something more with him in those sequels.
 

8. Iris West

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It was recently confirmed that Kiersey Clemons will reprise the role of Iris West in The Flash, and that's something we're very pleased about. The actress only makes a cameo appearance in the Snyder Cut of Justice League, but she makes a big impact with only a small amount of screentime. 

Yes, this is very much Barry Allen's sequence, but the chemistry between them is palpable. 

If Snyder's plan was to get us invested in the potential relationship Barry and Iris would one day have, it worked. We obviously know nothing about what Clemons' take on the character was once going to look like, or how that will differ in Andy Muschietti's take on The Flash. However, we certainly hope the first meeting remains canon because it was a heck of a way to kick things off.
 

7. Mera

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Yes, we're counting Mera as a completely different character. Why? Well, the English accent, for starters!

That gives the Atlantean a new, regal persona, and she's definitely a little more ready for a fight than the one we saw in the theatrical cut of Justice League. That first meeting does play out mostly the same, but this Mera clearly has an attraction to Arthur which is teased when she's later on land.

However, the Knightmare scene is really where Heard comes into her own as the hero. Carrying Jerry Cans of water, she now wields Arthur's trident and wants to kill Darksied for what he did to Aquaman. It's a cool take on Mera, but not one that's likely to influence what we end up seeing in Aquaman 2.
 

6. Ryan Choi

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Ryan Choi is an effective supporting character in Zack Snyder's Justice League, and we simply cannot figure out why he was left on the cutting room floor back in 2017 (it's not as if Warner Bros. had other big plans for the character at the time). Of course, many of his scenes are with Dr. Silas Stone.

That's another character whose role was almost completely rewritten by Whedon, so it likely explains why Choi was no longer part of proceedings. Regardless, Kai Zheng does a great job here. 

By the end of the movie, it's revealed that he's S.T.A.R. Labs' Director of Nanotechnology, so the stage was clearly being set for him to become The Atom in the Chinese-led spinoff Snyder has recently teased. It's a shame we'll never get to see that, especially as what we see here works so well. 
 

5. Elinore Stone

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Cyborg's mother was pretty much a non-factor in 2017's Justice League, something that robbed Victor Stone of much of his backstory (and lessened the significance of the accident he was in). 

In the Snyder Cut, we see Elinore fighting to protect her son, and supporting him when he plays football. Silas, meanwhile, is too busy working, and the crash which killed her and gravely injures Victor happens on the way home from that game. It's a small yet meaningful role, and helps better explain why Cyborg feels the way he does towards his father before he sacrifices his life. 

It also leads to a much stronger, more effective ending; rather than goofing around with his dad and showing off his new look, Victor moves past his anger and grief to become a superhero. 
 

4. Martian Manhunter

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Snyder has gone on record to say that he hoped to include the John Stewart version of Green Lantern in his cut of Justice League, but Warner Bros. said no, and that's why we have Martian Manhunter.

It's a shame in some ways that Stewart wasn't the one who showed up to talk to Bruce Wayne at the end of the movie, but we definitely enjoyed what we saw from this interpretation of J'onn J'onzz. He looks awesome, and Harry Lennix proved to be a fitting choice to bring the character to life here. 

His role was a minimal one, that's for sure, but what we saw was a lot of fun. This is another character with a tonne of potential moving forward, and while it seems unlikely that will happen, we'd sure like it to.
 

3. Darkseid

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When Joss Whedon took charge of Justice League, he completely scrapped Darkseid's role and made Steppenwolf a one-and-done villain. Yes, the big bad was mentioned, but only in a throwaway manner. There was no reason to suspect he'd ever actually show up, and the only sequel teases we got were those which laid the groundwork for the Injustice Society to assemble.

Well, Darkseid gets plenty of memorable moments in the Snyder Cut. As well as a terrifying glimpse into the future (where he kills Aquaman and Wonder Woman), the stage is set for his invasion of Earth.

We know that leads to Superman falling under the influence of the Anti-Life Equation, and we can only hope that's now explored in some format moving forward. Ray Porter did an awesome job with the villain, that's for sure, and while he may not be a big name, he proved himself worthy of playing Darkseid.
 

2. Joker

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Thanks to Warner Bros., much of Jared Leto's Joker performance in Suicide Squad ended up on the cutting room floor. What we saw wasn't to everyone's liking, but it was hard to judge it fairly. 

Well, the Oscar-winner is given a second chance in Zack Snyder's Justice League, and he makes the most of it. Despite being a post-apocalyptic version of the Clown Prince of Crime, this feels like a far more authentic take on the character. The meeting between Batman and Joker is awesome, and the way he taunts the Dark Knight over Robin's death is one of the DCEU's best moments.

While this scene probably didn't convert anyone who isn't sold on Leto's interpretation of the iconic villain, it's now hard not to hope the actor isn't given at least once more shot at playing him. 
 

1. Cyborg

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Let's face it, the Cyborg we saw in 2017 is most definitely not the same one in 2021. Almost all of the actor's scenes were reshot by Whedon, so the Snyder Cut delivers a vastly different interpretation. 

This Victor Stone is grieving for his mother, and dealing with a whole lot of resentment towards his father. As the movie progresses, he manages to overcome that and embrace his new status quo as a superhero; that nicely sets the stage for where his story was supposed to go next under Snyder's watch.

Throw in a much more effective portrayal of Cyborg's powers, and everything we saw in the Snyder Cut of Justice League with this character was new, improved, and downright awesome. That's why he deserves the #1 spot, and while Ray Fisher is likely done with the hero, it will take an awful lot to top this. 
 

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TheMapleSyrup
TheMapleSyrup - 4/12/2021, 6:06 AM
I was sure that Steppenwolf ripping Cyborg in half would have been in the Snyder cut. Not sure if it's racially charged though. I thought it was a cool enough looking shot
Supercat6376
Supercat6376 - 4/12/2021, 6:10 AM
he was great in the Snyder cut but naaa man black characters like all sortz of other characters can be killed in all sorts of ways.
GhostDog
GhostDog - 4/12/2021, 6:10 AM
"It was not a good look to essentially pull this Black man, who has already endured so much physical trauma, limb from limb."


Black people made it through seeing Apollo get the one of the worst and most brutal ASS WHOOPINGS EVER, we would've endured this one too


Blergh
Blergh - 4/12/2021, 6:12 AM
Here we go again,
Ray, it was NOT your job to rein these people in. You were not paid to fight for Snyder's vision or to stick to his script. It was your job to act according to the new and changed script.

Now, had they changed your character to a racist depiction of a black superhero you would be well in your rights to fight back. But what you're telling us is nothing racially charged. Mildly stupid perhaps.

His seems convinced he's doing the right thing but I don't see it.
He's fighting battles that were never his to fight
whynot
whynot - 4/12/2021, 7:01 AM
@Blergh - 100% agree! All this Joss bashing seems a bit crappy especially when Ray was the one in the wrong. You get paid to do a job not b!tch and whine when the director tells you to do this. Honestly when I look at Joss record at making above average movies i start to think these actors are the one that sabotaged the movie.
Blergh
Blergh - 4/12/2021, 7:10 AM
@whynot - I get the Whedon bashing, he turned out to be a far from kind human being that deserves the cancellation he got.

But as of right now it feels more that Ray simply took thought he was responsible for aspects of the shooting that he simply wasn't.

Some directors fire you when you change a simple line to be an easier fit for your voice and tone. But this is more or less an actor trying to change the script in a major way.

For someone who harps on how Zack's vision should be respected he certainly gave no effort in respecting Whedons vision (ass or not)
Origame
Origame - 4/12/2021, 9:31 AM
@Blergh - well I mean this is coming from the guy who thinks booyah is racist.
Kumkani
Kumkani - 4/12/2021, 6:15 AM
"It was not a good look to essentially pull this Black man, who has already endured so much physical trauma, limb from limb."

But this is Cyborg we're talking about. The character is literally a Black man that is usually written to be defined as his physical trauma. In Zack Snyder's Justice League Cyborg is the one character with the most physical trauma, arguably the one that has his emotional trauma explored the most, is the only one that walks with a hunchback/limp, and is given even more trauma by having to watch his father kill himself.

I'm not saying Fisher's feelings are invalid but I just don't see the big difference between what Whedon did (as in, what we see in the actual film) and what Snyder did because these things are inherent to the character. Out of all the characters in the film he is the one that feels the most like a social outcast in both versions, and he's the only black Justice League member.

I think Whedon's behaviour is what makes Ray Fisher feel differently and that's valid, but to me the end results are the same.
GhostDog
GhostDog - 4/12/2021, 6:17 AM
@Kumkani - "But this is Cyborg we're talking about. The character is literally a Black man that is usually written to be defined as his physical trauma."

Fisher:
Kumkani
Kumkani - 4/12/2021, 6:28 AM
@BlackBeltJones - I really don't get it. I'm not saying Cyborg can't ever be reappropriated but to do that you pretty much have to make the character anew and at least surround him with other Black characters to help balance things out. Neither Whedon nor Snyder did any of those things.

It's like choosing to play Shang-Chi and being mad that the character is a Chinese man that knows kung-fu and some of the stereotypes that can come with that. Or playing Black Panther and finding out that some elements of the character are African stereotypes (as a Nigerian, I don't even represent all of Africa and I can tell you that they're there.).
GhostDog
GhostDog - 4/12/2021, 6:37 AM
@Kumkani - for all the research he claimed to have done, I don't get how he doesn't understand the central mark of the character. This is who he is.
Origame
Origame - 4/12/2021, 6:18 AM
Yes, because all superheroes should be kept safe and untouched. That's why we love superheroes so much, choosing a safe profession. And the only reason why a villain would harm a hero is discrimination.
LongMayHeReign
LongMayHeReign - 4/12/2021, 6:58 AM
@Origame -

Robot/Android characters in particular are made to be destroyed, Ray is an idiot!





Origame
Origame - 4/12/2021, 7:22 AM
@LongMayHeReign - I've been meaning to say how offensive infinity war was to British people.
Goldboink
Goldboink - 4/12/2021, 9:01 AM
@Origame -
No, he's native american!
Origame
Origame - 4/12/2021, 9:16 AM
@Goldboink - I see what you did there.
Reeds2Much
Reeds2Much - 4/12/2021, 6:19 AM
Meanwhile ...
VileBlood
VileBlood - 4/12/2021, 6:49 AM
@Waddles - You can see the look of betrayal and disappointment in Bucky's eyes which really hurts. Great scene.
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