EDITORIAL: Where Do We Go From Here? (The Avengers)

EDITORIAL: Where Do We Go From Here?  (The Avengers)

The Avengers has performed even better than the most optimistic predicted, setting records we didn't know existed. What is it going to take to top it? Does TDKR even stand a chance now that we know what it is up against. If not, who does?

Editorial Opinion
By jerichomccune - May 06, 2012 03:05 PM EST
Filed Under: Avengers


The Avengers is a success in every sense of the word. Fans are ecstatic. Critics are raving. Everyone involved in the film is making a mint and The Avengers may be the new record holder for a single film holding the largest number of box office dollars and attendance records in history.

The US opening weekend is wrapping up and the total stands at $641.8 million dollars. We won't know exact numbers until after all the screens go dark, but at this point they barely matter. IMAX and 3D numbers are off the charts with tickets selling out, so next week's numbers are sure to be strong considering how willing people are to unload extra cash for premium seats. Some more records will be set. Anyone arguing that the film won't see $1 billion is just treading water until there is absolute proof. Then they will find another reason to hate on something.

Even now that numbers are in, there is a question that looms in the mind of all fanboys: will The Dark Knight Rises beat The Avengers? Batman has performed stronger than the other superheroes in a head to head confrontation, but Earth's Mightiest have proven to be a sum larger than its parts. By the time TDKR rolls into theaters, Avengers exhaustion will have been followed by The Amazing Spider-Man, Men In Black III, Battleship, Snow White and the Huntsman, Prometheus, Brave, Abraham Lincoln: Vampire Hunter and G.I. Joe: Retaliation, each one competing for those big screen action dollars Avengers has proven exist for entertainment worthy enough. That's a lot of forty foot explosions in a short amount of time, and a humble return from high-expectation films like Spider-Man, G.I. Joe and Brave could make people more hesitant to purchase a ticket.

Additionally, TDKR hasn't had the $100 million dollar marketing campaign that The Avengers had. Both are built on franchises, Nolan's being consistently good while the Marvel Cinematic Universe has always fared well, if not exceptional, but Marvel's is much broader. They're able to appeal to an audience wide enough to include everyone, while Nolan's dark, visceral take on the Dark Knight isn't to some tastes. The truth is at this point, TDKR has to pull something out of a magic hat to hope to have a shot at the numbers we're seeing. Peter Sciretta at /Film tweeted this on Sunday afternoon:


In a superheroic synchronicity, at the same moment that tweet rolled into my feed, I was listening to Kevin Smith's SModcast.

His show is a potpourri of pop culture and cinema secrets. It's also a talk show, and talk radio is good for the soul even if it is composed mostly of fellatio jokes and Star Wars references. On this particular show, he gave his interpretation of what would be a transcendental Batman story. Batman dies and goes to heaven, where he is allowed to go to any age in his life and live forever. He chooses to go back to being a child, when his parents were alive, only to discover his parents are in hell. He has to fight his way in to hell to get them back.

The preface to the story is an interesting rumor that is floating around, one that could also be a serious game changer. What if Christopher Nolan kills Batman?

It is a macabre truth that the untimely death of Heath Ledger boosted early ticket sales, helping launch The Dark Knight to the perch on which it currently resides and Marvel fans are hoping to knock down a peg. If that wouldn't have happened (if ifs and buts were candy and nuts...), the numbers still would have been admirable because the movie was amazing, but the accident did something normal publicity couldn't. It created an intense audience connection with one of the most disturbed supervillains to hit the screen. It was an Oscar-winning performance that cemented the Ledger legacy in movie history and people wanted to see it again and again.

What would it take to repeat that performance? God forbid any real life tragedy of any magnitude occur, so for TDKR to really sell the number of tickets it needs to match The Avengers, it has to do something never done before. Opening weekend numbers aren't going to succeed because the film will probably run longer than usual. It also won't be shown in 3D, which will mean more full seats are needed to match those extra dollars. Where TDKR will really have to shine is repeat attendance. The drop between first week and second week will be crucial. Killing Bruce Wayne in the final act is the perfect way to create the intense buzz they need.

This is the final film in Nolan's Dark Knight Trilogy. For those that haven't seen the trailers, let me remind you:


Nolan is giving us a cinematic graphic novel. It had an appropriately named beginning and now it will have a conclusion. It is one story, in three acts and three films. Expect it to be Return of the Bat, the most exceptional movie in an exceptional movie trilogy. Will that be enough to make it the box office bonanza fanboys want?

It could be, especially if they kill the bat. A Moriarty/Holmes-esque battle with Bane could leave the audience in a state of shock and awe. Everybody knows that any future Batman films will be a reboot of the story. The Dark Knight saga is wrapping up and there's no real confirmation on whether it will be back soon. A likely model would be that DC and Warner Bros. will shelve Gotham's hero for the short term in an effort to start working on the other characters needed for their future team superhero movie. The best way to get bang for their buck would be to kill the hero - they did it with Superman to sell funny books. Everybody knows the bat will be back, but the short-term anguish over the death of a superhero (how often does that actually happen?) would certainly act as a catalyst.

If the bat doesn't dethrone the band of superhero misfits that is currently monopolizing news feeds, there doesn't seem to be a short term player that could. Taking the characters solo again will probably continue to be successful, but it is likely they'll perform similarly to the earlier films or slightly below. One or two breakaway successes will occur, but it's doubtful Marvel will match Avengers numbers until the sequel.

Spider-Man seems like an obvious choice, but the poor reception of Spider-Man 3 by the fanbase makes it unlikely. Another mutant team movie could step up the game, but the X-Men franchise doesn't seem to have what it takes to step it up this much. New Mutants is an interesting possibility, but the marketing campaign would have to be brilliant and the movie would have to do something completely new with the mutant story. Then there is the Hunger Games sequel. That can't be dismissed, but the franchise is so young we still have to see what kind of legs it has. The first film is still in theaters and The Avengers is sure to destroy it monetarily.

Given the time they need, the much rumored and eventually expected JLA movie that DC is sure to work on has the potential. That won't be for years. The field as it sets is full of strong contenders, but the throne should be secure for a while. The next best bet is The Avengers 2, but we'll all be paying attention, waiting for a dark horse to separate from the pack.

I would love to see the studios prove me wrong.





About The Author:
jerichomccune
Member Since 4/21/2012
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Knightrider
Knightrider - 5/6/2012, 3:40 PM
Good points, and finally an article where you compare the two without resorting to I love one and hate the other. Think it'll be close in terms of money, however both will make millions it is that simple. However TDKR marketing hasn't kicked in yet, I remember being a month out from Avengers and not having a final trailer. So both will make a lot, hopefully both are fantastic and we can safely say we've had the best summer ever for CBM's.
jerichomccune
jerichomccune - 5/6/2012, 3:45 PM
Knightrider - Thanks for the kind words. I took the category "editorial" seriously, so I tried to be as objective as possible. The question I was asking couldn't possibly be affected by my opinion, so I thought it best to mostly leave it out.
Zarog
Zarog - 5/6/2012, 3:50 PM
Great editorial. Interesting to think about, but I think the real question is what is the long term life of the Avengers. If it has a 70% drop in the 2nd weekend, it would still do well, but there would be vulnerability. TDK's big thing wasn't it's opening numbers, it was how long-lasting the movie was. I think the real question is what will the end gross for the Avengers be? It's going to be a huge hit (already is), but it probably won't break the $2 billion mark unless word of mouth continues to keep the movie extremely strong through the next 4 weeks. After that it's going to start taking hits from more and more major releases. TDK didn't really have to contend with anything for about 5 weeks in theaters because no one wanted their movie going up against a character like Batman.

Avatar 2 will be the movie I put money on to break all the records that the Avengers sets. Avatar was a movie event everyone wanted to go see and it had lasting power. Avatar 2 will probably be the same. Possibly the first movie to break $3 billion at the box office.
CorndogBurglar
CorndogBurglar - 5/6/2012, 4:07 PM
Very well written editorial, something that us a rarity kn this site. Hats off.

As for what will make more, I think Batman has a very high hill to climb. I get that this is the last in the series and there are a lot of people that will go for that reason alone. I also get that both the Batman movies were very well received.

However, avengers has been breaking records left and right. Who is to say what the final take will be? It has already blasted by all the predictions of what it was supposed to make, so it really is anybody's guess right now.

Nolan begter have something special with this one or it isn't going to beat out avengers.
gamecreatorjj
gamecreatorjj - 5/6/2012, 4:10 PM
all i know is when i went at midngiht there was applause for the TDKR trailer, when i went the next day, (not alot of comic book people there) there was just as much applause, Avengers will/has broken records, but everybody who saw it, also got a taste of TDKR, which will break a billion, but so will avengers, hopefully when avengers breaks its billion, Feige will get some sense and realize, hulk was the best part, and they will make the HULK 2
Zarog
Zarog - 5/6/2012, 4:14 PM
Why is this not on the main page yet? I think this is quite possibly the best editorial I've read on this site.
golden123
golden123 - 5/6/2012, 4:14 PM
The Avengers doesn't necessarily have a wider demographic than Nolan's Batman trilogy. The recent Batman film appeal plenty of people The Avengers doesn't appeal to and vice versa. Either way, both movie (franchises) have loads of fans. Most of the fans are also supporters of the other.

As for Avatar II, I think the sequel will gross a whole lot less money. Many people that saw Avatar in theaters aren't going to see the sequel in theaters. Besides the first Avatar is only number forty on the list of Biggest Opening Weekends at the box office.
jerichomccune
jerichomccune - 5/6/2012, 4:22 PM
Thanks for the support everyone.

I apologize for leaving Avatar sequels out of the analysis. I would blame my complete disinterest in the first one, but I mentioned earlier that the point was to leave emotion out of it so I'll blame it on my dim bulb.

Honestly, I think one of Avatar's most impressive features was its use of 3D technology. The sequel won't have that to prop it up any more because 3D isn't unique now. It'll need a much stronger story and character development, an area in which I felt the first was really weak.

Additionally, I see The Avengers with strong sprinting legs. I don't know when it'll stop, but when it does it will have covered distance heretofore unrealized. It might not top end at number one, but it will get close and it is making noise we barely dreamed of hearing on the journey.
Gerrit
Gerrit - 5/6/2012, 6:04 PM
Well, in the midnight screening I went, people only applauded The Avengers. Not a single applaud for TDKR. But with all the competition coming, I doubt The Avengers will make as much as Titanic or Avatar, unfortunately.
Zarog
Zarog - 5/6/2012, 6:54 PM
@brazilianbatman I'm not sure what you're arguing. I never talked about the demographics at all. I was essentially stating the reason TDK did as well as it did was in part because there was no other major blockbuster movie released any time in the next several weeks, so TDK had overall less competition. In the coming weeks the Avengers will be competing with Dark Shadows, Battleship, The Dictator, and Men In Black III. That's just in May. Compared to what TDK faced in its theatrical run, that's a murderer's row. The competition is going to catch up with the Avengers at some point, and I don't see it as having as much longevity as TDK. Although I am 99% sure that it will out gross TDK by a significant margin. I just think most of the gross will come in the next 14 days, and then it won't make very much money in the following weekends due to competing movies.
Knightrider
Knightrider - 5/6/2012, 7:45 PM
@Brazillianbatman the thing is, it won't carry on like this, it will decline like any other movie, and sometimes even for big blockbusters these declines can be sharp and harsh especially once competition starts popping up.

@Jericho I would not worry about leaving Avatar out, as I don't see this doing as well, personally most people I know didn't enjoy the movie apart from being nice to look at. However people seem to be getting over the 3D fad (Wish they would hurry up and get over it), which was its main selling point. Avatar as a film isn't very good, and isn't anything we hadn't seen before, however I will give Cameroon credit for a 3D movie all the characters well very 1 dimensional - I am corporate boss so me greedy, well I am army boss so me bad and nasty and don't forget me I am wheel chair man who is only siding with this race because they look pretty.
JonasWepeel
JonasWepeel - 5/6/2012, 9:46 PM
I hope they both make eleventy billion dollars. But you make valid points. I'm curious to see which ones people are still watching 20-30 years from now.
jerichomccune
jerichomccune - 5/6/2012, 10:09 PM
Ah, yes, The Avengers may make eleventy billion dollar. But then the question arises: will TDKR make eleventy-one billion dollars?!

Who knows? We could all get blindsided and Battleship could sink it. Wouldn't that be about the most interesting thing that could happen this summer? I'm predicting Battleship to be Pearl Harbor 2: More Ships Sink and We Still Don't Care, but anything could happen until something does!
Minotauro
Minotauro - 5/7/2012, 12:19 AM
Some of you are getting to carried away with your predictions, it's laughable. TDKR won't do so good, because it has to much to compete with? Total Recall, and Bourne Legacy?? Give me a break.

@Knightrider - Avatar won't do well? Sounds to me alot of people are joining the contrarian society that believe they can predict something will fail when it was amazingly successful the first go around. Avatar gained fans, and they will follow. James Cameron knows how to make eye candy films, which CBMers are suckers for(Avengers for example)and they will tune in as well. Anything else is denial, or they just feel the need to rebel against something they thinks too popular.

And finally, will the TDKR be successful after the Avengers? Well, that's what Nolan does best. He's not trying to make a great CBM. He's making a great "movie".
TDKR and it's hype train carrying two oscars, 94% RT rating, and #8 in the Top 250 films of all time(tainted voting system to be fair)#14 film of all time(Empireonline.com)and has nothing to worry about.

And when it's all said and done. It "could" be the best CBM trilogy ever. We don't know yet. But could. ;)
calin88
calin88 - 5/7/2012, 4:27 AM
If Batman is killed he will come back from the dead and stick a batarang in Nolan's ass, I'm fine with the hero to die, but never Batman!!!
CraptainAmerica
CraptainAmerica - 5/7/2012, 4:34 AM
Great example of a well written, well balanced and great example of a great editorial!

Some seriously good, unbiased, points made.

I think that The Avengers is still in its infancy where the cinema/theater showings are concerned. There are those that will have held out on seeing it because it's been so busy (in the UK most of my friends are waiting as its been constantly sold out). There are DVD/blu-ray sales to consider.

I think the point raised about the amount of money invested into The Avengers compared to that of TDKR is very true. But, The Avengers may no have seen such a huge draw had they not have plastered the name everywhere.

I think another point I consider is that they are both very different movies. The Avengers was brilliance in terms of acting, script writing and all out entertainment. If TDKR is anything like the TDK it becomes a perfect example of great filmmaking in general. It's not just about a superhero, it has depth. I'm not taking that away from The Avengers but TDKR won't be as set on entertaining one and all. It also has the added bonus that 'Spiderman 3' had. It follows a very popular sequel. In TDKR case, a VERY popular sequel. No doubt it will be the same for any Avengers, potential, sequel. That may be the stumbling block for The Amazing Spiderman. Excitement from the general public may be lower due to a lacklustre threequel. But the bar in terms of bettering his last movie outing is not as high.

I will enjoy all of these movies separately for what they are. I don't think it's fair to compare too closely as the themes, styling and execution for all three are very different. They only way to judge how they may, possibly, do at the box office and overall is to consider previous trends with similar movies. We as fanboys can judge what is popular among ourselves. But it's the millions more who have no emotional/nostalgic stake in these movies.

All I know is it's going to be one hell of a year for movies in general. Sorry for the ramblings. Great article again!

Your Craptain salutes you!
Spock
Spock - 5/7/2012, 11:34 AM
I don't really care as long its a good movie! Iam a fan not a Marketing guy!
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