James Gunn Says Corporate Mandate "Killed" Marvel Studios; Reveals Likelihood Of Future MCU/DCU Crossover

James Gunn Says Corporate Mandate "Killed" Marvel Studios; Reveals Likelihood Of Future MCU/DCU Crossover

Superman director James Gunn shares his thoughts on Marvel Studios' recent struggles and points to orders from higher up the food chain being a problem. He also discusses a potential MCU/DC crossover.

By JoshWilding - Jun 16, 2025 01:06 PM EST
Filed Under: Marvel Studios
Source: Rolling Stone

It's no secret that the Multiverse Saga has seen Marvel Studios struggle to recapture the success it found with the Infinity Saga. There have been critical and commercial disappointments in theaters and on streaming, with much of the blame for that laid at the feet of former Disney CEO Bob Chapek.

He pressured Kevin Feige to produce an increased number of theatrical and Disney+ titles, stretching the executive thin. It also led to a level of MCU fatigue created by too many stories for people to keep up with and an abundance of superhero content. 

Marvel Studios is attempting to course correct, though that's proving to be easier said than done if Thunderbolts* is any indication. The movie received glowing reviews, but it will fail to break even by the time its box office run concludes. Now, all hopes are being pinned on The Fantastic Four: First Steps to succeed.

Rolling Stone put it to Guardians of the Galaxy director and DC Studios co-CEO James Gunn that there are similarities between Superman and The Fantastic Four, though the filmmaker wasn't inclined to agree. 

"Maybe. But do you really think they’re alike? I’m really embracing the Silver Age of it all, but I don’t think that it’s as stylized, or at least not stylized in the same way," he countered. "And it’s not as retro. There are retro-futuristic aspects, because we’ve got Daily Planet with a big [frick]ing [globe]. And the robots, the machinery. So I can see where there’s certain similarities."

When Marvel's struggles were broached, Gunn said, "[Longtime Marvel executive producer] Louis [D’Esposito] said [they put out too much stuff] privately to me. I don’t even know if it’s really their fault. That wasn’t fair. It wasn’t right. And it killed them."

"We have to treat every project as if we’re lucky. We don’t have the mandate to have a certain amount of movies and TV shows every year," he said of how DC Studios' approach will differ. "So we’re going to put out everything that we think is of the highest quality. We’re obviously going to do some good things and some not-so-good things, but hopefully on average everything will be as high-quality as possible."

Superhero movies are no longer guaranteed to be $1 billion hits, and that's not lost on Gunn. Many fans believe it's inevitable that Marvel and DC will eventually be forced to join forces for a crossover movie meant to reignite interest in the genre. 

For Gunn, the idea of the two worlds colliding on screen is less about box office revenue and more about his own fandom and what's best for these characters. 

"We’ve talked about it a billion times. That could easily happen, but simultaneous to that, I think it would be interesting. But I also think people are a little over it. I think people wanna see good stories with their superheroes and that’s what matters. And they wanna see different types of stories with their superheroes. And people love superheroes. That’s obvious, but they need more variety, and they need just more quality storytelling. And just having Spider-Man and Superman team up isn’t gonna do it if it’s shit. So it’s gotta come from a real place, and it’s really hard to make that work."

"I did Superman because I loved the character. And I was excited about writing that movie. If I were to write a Superman-versus-Spider-Man movie, is it a concept I’m gonna be like, 'Oh, yeah, this could be a great film'? Or am I doing it because 'Oh, yeah, people want to see Superman and Spider-Man team up'? For me, it would have to be — if we ever did that, it would have to be under someone who thought it was gonna be awesome and wasn’t just a cash grab, because I’m just not into that."

Will we get an MCU/DCU crossover? It's clearly not outside the realm of possibility, but doesn't appear to be a priority for either studio right now. Depending on how the next few years go, that may change at any time. 

In the meantime, Marvel Studios remains focused on returning to its former glory and Gunn in looking to establish the DCU as a success after the DCEU's many failings. 

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Comicmoviejunki
Comicmoviejunki - 6/16/2025, 1:36 PM
Duh
TheRedLeader
TheRedLeader - 6/16/2025, 1:36 PM
Disney+ killed Marvel, Pixar and Star Wars.
The need to put out content on the monthly basis destroyed the creativity of these studios.
Humperdink
Humperdink - 6/16/2025, 7:30 PM
@TheRedLeader -

Is that why Robert Rodriguez had Boba Fett smiling and humping a speeder biker? No time to write anything better?

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McMurdo
McMurdo - 6/16/2025, 8:54 PM
@TheRedLeader - Kathleen Kennedy*
RitoRevolto
RitoRevolto - 6/16/2025, 8:59 PM
@TheRedLeader - Throw Bob Chapek in there too. He doesn't get enough blame for the overall damage he's dealt.
GeneralZod
GeneralZod - 6/16/2025, 1:37 PM
@Nomis929 seems that your wish of a DC/Marvel cross-over film is not so far-fetched anymore!
Nomis929
Nomis929 - 6/16/2025, 1:51 PM
@GeneralZod - General, I have literally been saying that's going to happen on here for over a decade.

And with the staus of the companies movies with audiences today, MCU is drowning, DC reboot is uncertian, and even the state of comic book movies in general, IT MIGHT BE WHAT WILL BE NEEEDED TO SAVE THE GENRE.
GeneralZod
GeneralZod - 6/16/2025, 2:08 PM
@Nomis929 -
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GeneralZod
GeneralZod - 6/16/2025, 2:21 PM
@Nomis929 - I just hope we are both alive when the DCU/MCU movie comes out.
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Nomis929
Nomis929 - 6/16/2025, 2:22 PM
@GeneralZod -

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Sure, it's a gimmick, but a gimmick that will pay off handsomely, and save the genre.
Nomis929
Nomis929 - 6/16/2025, 2:30 PM
@GeneralZod - Well, I'm in the middle of working on my "Benjamin Button" reverse aging machine....just in case.
CaptainFlapjaks
CaptainFlapjaks - 6/16/2025, 3:10 PM
@GeneralZod - im of the belief that if snyderverse was a success, the marvel multiverse saga would have ended with marvel vs dc. And with gunns The suicide squad being in the dcu, fieges relationship with gunn could have allowed it to happen. I think now they are getting the ground running on the universe, i dont think dc want to do that too soon at least on screen. But a game with marvel vs dc is something i think has a high likelihood of happening now given that relationship.
Matador
Matador - 6/16/2025, 3:14 PM
@Nomis929 @GeneralZod - If anything by the time it comes around will all be Force Ghost's and just see the movie for free.
GeneralZod
GeneralZod - 6/16/2025, 3:17 PM
@CaptainFlapjaks - Yeah, i agree. Game first (mid-term deliverable -- probably 3 to 5 years) ... then movie, 6 to 10 years from now. DCU has to build a foundation after the mess Snyder left behind. That takes about 5 years to get the foundation laid. And MCU has to course-correct their misguided ship -- they need 3 years to do that. (FF doesn't look like it will do the trick.)
Arthorious
Arthorious - 6/16/2025, 3:29 PM
@Nomis929 - and then capcom makes Marvel vs DC
CaptainFlapjaks
CaptainFlapjaks - 6/16/2025, 3:45 PM
@Arthorious - some are thinking it could be netherrealms next game
SpideyQuad
SpideyQuad - 6/16/2025, 5:09 PM
@Nomis929 - Please don't scream
McMurdo
McMurdo - 6/16/2025, 8:55 PM
@Matador - LOL! 😆
MisterBones
MisterBones - 6/16/2025, 1:39 PM
This seemed obvious but hearing Gunn confirm such really does put a lot into context
TheJok3r
TheJok3r - 6/16/2025, 1:40 PM
Disney Plus is the worst thing to happen to not just Marvel, but Star Wars as well. It seems like irreversible damage has been done to both brands.
Vigor
Vigor - 6/16/2025, 1:55 PM
@TheJok3r - I don't agree with the star wars part. The worst thing we got from star wars were episodes 7, 8, and 9
They did not first appear on disney plus. They were theatrical releases

Disney plus gave us andor and mandalorian
Methos5000
Methos5000 - 6/16/2025, 5:23 PM
@TheJok3r - lol 90% of the population has no idea those Disney + shows even existed.
McMurdo
McMurdo - 6/16/2025, 8:55 PM
@Vigor - facts
AgentofSH1ELD
AgentofSH1ELD - 6/16/2025, 1:41 PM
Gunn already scared and considering ways to save his DCU. :P
MyCoolYoung
MyCoolYoung - 6/16/2025, 1:42 PM
I don’t see a crossover happening honestly. I just look at how hard the Spider-Man and marvel arrangement has been
TheVisionary25
TheVisionary25 - 6/16/2025, 1:49 PM
@MyCoolYoung - agreed

The arrangement with Sony already seems to be a hassle from the little we know so to then bring in a whole new studio just isn’t feasible
MyCoolYoung
MyCoolYoung - 6/16/2025, 2:01 PM
@TheVisionary25 - Yup. Gunn, Feige, and co. may be fans, but execs care about the money. They'll always come to "we can probably make that money ourselves."
TrentCrimm
TrentCrimm - 6/16/2025, 3:07 PM
@MyCoolYoung -

I can't see it happening either.

It would be 100% fan service and not much else, because the general audience that doesn't know comics, they don't know the differences between Marvel or DC, they're all just superheros and comic books to those people. The draw of A Marvel and DC crossover is something that's really only going to have an impact with fans, the GA will just see another superhero movie, that's not enough to drive the box office up enough to make it worth while.
MyCoolYoung
MyCoolYoung - 6/16/2025, 6:43 PM
@TrentCrimm - I get the fan service part of it. I’d actually be down for a crossover, but a movie of that magnitude has to make endgame money to pacify both studios, in my opinion
ObserverIO
ObserverIO - 6/17/2025, 10:20 AM
@MyCoolYoung - It would make Endgame money. And that movie was mostly fan-service too.
Pictilli
Pictilli - 6/16/2025, 1:43 PM
Just another day of James Gunn being absolutely correct as usual.

Hail Gunn!
WakandaTech
WakandaTech - 6/16/2025, 1:49 PM
Telling half your paying customers to go fvck themselves for not wanting DEI in their movies was a big part of it too

Proof

Thunderbolts was a pretty good movie
but it still was a massive flop

Vigor
Vigor - 6/16/2025, 1:53 PM
@WakandaTech - your second statement doesnt align with your first
newhire13
newhire13 - 6/16/2025, 2:09 PM
@WakandaTech - I don’t care, F anybody who calls it DEI because the leads aren’t white/male/straight.
GeneralZod
GeneralZod - 6/16/2025, 2:19 PM
@newhire13 - That's not what DEI is. Perfectly ok to have non-"white/male/straight" leads. Not OK to gender-bend two male characters and cast them into a movie purely to provide gender balance. Neither Ghost (she/her/hers) nor Taskmaster (she/her/hers) added anything to the film and were an outright distraction.
@WakandaTech
mountainman
mountainman - 6/16/2025, 2:21 PM
@Vigor - It makes complete sense. Thunderbolts, despite positive reviews from critics and the audience, still failed to turn a profit since the MCU has driven away a lot of former fans.

OP is likely overstating the 1/2 of the fanbase that has turned away for this reason, but that stuff has resulted in SOME reduction in audience size.
CreateNowSlpL8r
CreateNowSlpL8r - 6/16/2025, 4:11 PM
@GeneralZod - uh oh, you pissed off a true believer lol
CreateNowSlpL8r
CreateNowSlpL8r - 6/16/2025, 4:17 PM
@mountainman - I dont care what they call it. Im not paying anymore money to see my male heroes decontructued and emasculated, or gender swapped and discarded. Im over the girl boss trope and really, since this started in 2016, how many successfull girl boss movies have their been outside the Rey movies which helped kill the brand? Furiosa and Ballerina werent bad movies but the general audience is just lumping them in with the trope.

The customer always used to be right but Disney decided they would stand on some moral high ground and insult you if you didnt pay to see thier product. Its kind of narcissistic if you ask me.

They dont make good stories anymore and they lack compelling, interesting characters. I dont have to watch this garbage.

@WakandaTech @GeneralZod
JDL
JDL - 6/16/2025, 4:36 PM
@WakandaTech - To be a massive flop would have required B.O. in $200M's. Flop implies failure in excess of the norm. This one is going to approach $400M and had it done a $100 more would have been considered a success. That's underperforming, nothing more.
SpideyQuad
SpideyQuad - 6/16/2025, 5:17 PM
@CreateNowSlpL8r - You are correct you don't have to watch
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