Vigilantes in Society

Vigilantes in Society

Would they be accepted?

Editorial Opinion
By BuckyB7588 - Jan 07, 2009 12:01 AM EST
Filed Under: Other

To begin with, it is important to state one truth; that is, all comic book heroes, unless sanctioned by the government, are vigilantes. Superman, Batman, Spiderman, and now even Iron Man and all those who registered with the Superhuman Registration Act. When it comes to their acceptance in their own worlds, it depends on the writer, instance, and overall atmosphere. Superman is worshiped, Batman is respected, Spiderman is hated. Of course, it goes without saying that these characters are fake, along with the worlds they live in. But what would happen if people began dressing up in costumes and fighting crime. What if someone took things too seriously, and went out on their own. How would we act?

Much depends on their own actions. If they killed or simply captured (with some fighting), if they protected those being hurt, or went out looking for a fight. In some ways, this person would do good, they would be able to intercede where the police could not, be out on the street, saving victims.

Assuming this "hero" did not kill, and protected those who cannot protect themselves, than they would have my full support. In a lot of ways, I believe they would inspire good, and that if able to, it is their duty to fight for good in whatever capacity possible. Others would see this person as a violent instigator who sees the law only as guidelines to be followed. How can he break these laws and claim to support others?

Essentially, this comes down to ones view of ethics, or what is right. Is right doing good even if laws must be broken, or is right more Socratic, that is assuming the law is right and following it. Confucius believed that laws are put in place for a reason, but as times change, they must as well. Is it then, a question of time and environment that would make this vigilantism appropriate?

What do you think?

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CrookedJaw
CrookedJaw - 1/7/2009, 6:00 PM
I think vigilantism would be accepted in today's society. It all depends on how it is done though. Are they open about their service? are they heroic in their service like Superman? Or are they Frightening and secretive like Batman? That would all depend, but I see vigilantism as something of a "good samaritan" act. One citizen helping another when the law is not around. There is nothing wrong with that. As long as the Vigilante doesn't break any major laws (murder, etc.) most would be pretty accepting to a "protector" watching out for them every night. It would send the criminals a message, and the people one as well.
It is my kind of belief that I should stand up for those who have had wrong done to them. I find myself helping friends and others I don't know. Not in a super hero way, but in any way...when it comes down to it, saving people with vigilantism is essentially a good deed, a service...no different from walking an old woman across the street, or helping someone with a task.
blacksword7
blacksword7 - 1/7/2009, 6:04 PM
It's only a matter of time. Personally i think it has a lot to do with the media, we've gotten to a point in time where the media revolves a lot around these themes and i would not be suprised at all to see vigilantees appear in the coming years. i think it's safe to assume they would be nothing like batman or night owl, but costumed prowlers seem to be coming in the future.
CrookedJaw
CrookedJaw - 1/7/2009, 6:20 PM
true true with that...and I do think that masked prowlers are around the corner. Something like a Punisher (minus the killing) or a Rorschach (minus the Insanity) would be acceptable in todays society.
adamant877
adamant877 - 1/7/2009, 6:44 PM
I think that it would be impossible to assume that "vigilanteism" would be accepted in ANY true democratic society. There are checks and balances in place to provide a means for justice to be sought. We all know that justice does not always prevail, but to assume that anyone would be given quarter for providing their own means of justice is absurd.
It's not only counterproductive, but dangerous!
It all boils down to one simple fact... None of us share the same ideology when it comes to the definition of justice.
Some would say the death penalty is barbaric, while others would argue that capital punishment, in-and-of itself is a crime!
Some would argue that the Old Testament belief of "an eye for an eye" is true justice, but what about the New Testament belief that states "Turn the other cheek?"
Is pacifism the key, or do we strike quickly and finally? Who decides? "Who watches the Watchmen?"
saintc
saintc - 1/7/2009, 6:55 PM
Great article! But vigilantes do exist in society... sort of. I did an editorial on it a week back. RLSH... Check it out, they do exist... just more geeky than the comic books. http://www.comicbookmovie.com/fansites/PanelOfViolence/news/?a=5667
adamant877
adamant877 - 1/7/2009, 6:58 PM
I personally would cheer at hearing about a father who sought vengeance against the man who murdered or abused his son, but on the same note I would would be outraged to hear about some guy in a mask murdering drug addicts.
The most accurate portrayal of vigilante justice would be the modern day bounty hunter... But even he has to work inside the confines of the law, otherwise ALL OF HIS CAPTURED FELONS WOULD WALK FREE ON A TECHNICALITY!
adamant877
adamant877 - 1/7/2009, 7:02 PM
Oh, and I remember that article about the so-called "modern day super heroes", but none of these individuals have actually worked outside of the law to apprehend criminals. Most of those yahoos are just idiots who walk around town in costume helping little old ladies cross the street for crissakes!
MarkCassidy
MarkCassidy - 1/7/2009, 7:16 PM
its a really interesting article, id say i was leaning towards agreeing with vigilanteism but theres so many gray areas. Which crime, which criminals, what punishment?

When it comes to Rapists and really any violent crimes against decent people i dont have much of a problem with someone going full Punisher on them.

Put it this way, if Batman suddenly appeared in Dublin i wouldnt exactly protest it know what i mean
iNsaneMilesy
iNsaneMilesy - 1/7/2009, 8:58 PM
I think they would by the average person, to clean up say organised crime and gangbangers. But i think the aurthorities wouldn't, most likey because of jealousy. Take the police, most signed up to stop all these things yet are constrained by the law, unable to do what really needs to be done. To see somebody else do it would really be annoying, because even if they wanted to they cant because of those peramiters.
TheMyth
TheMyth - 1/7/2009, 10:17 PM
There is no way in hell America, or any other militarized nation, would ever accept vigilantism in any form. The police state we have become would completely obliterate any attempt, whether it be normal human or Superpowered, and would do so very quickly and efficiently. They would immediately start attempting to apprehend any such person clandestinely. If the vigilante's revealed publicly, a media barrage would pound them into the ground publicly and turn the people against them. This would cause a massive outcry for us to huddle under our governments wing, while the mdia continues to force us to fear this person by twisting events and portraying them in the way the little puppets are told. Meanwhile, our president "vigilantly promises this terrorist will be found by any means necessary." Hell, wouldn't be surprised if they blew up a few schools and hospitals, maybe collapse another skyskraper, in order to implement this hero(should they have superpowers or just be that hard to get, like Bats). And now that "superpeople" and such are surfacing, this is the perfect excuse for the government to institute a full police state with all the "Big Brother is watching you." type of shit. IT's a Nightmare I tell you a Nightmare.

ahem

To bad cause I really was hoping to absorb a Gamma Bomb explosion or something.
BuckyB7588
BuckyB7588 - 1/8/2009, 12:02 AM
gtrman

"and now even Iron Man and all those who registered with the Superhuman Registration Act."

No offense, but if they registered, aren't they then working FOR the government (SHIELD) and therefore, not a vigilante?


Tony Stark deleted all Shield Files when Osborn took over, so, the SRA is essentially deleted and gone.

The Myth

I think part of what you say is right, the government would go after them, but it could be a Gordon-Batman thing, where publicly they are, but in reality, they talk to them every day.

And blacksword, I totally agree with you, with all these superhero movies coming out, I wouldn't be surprised if we get a few Night Owls and Silk Spectres...
Shadowelfz
Shadowelfz - 1/8/2009, 1:05 AM
The problem with future vigilanties is that, in either case, the law would be the biggest hurdle to bringing these criminals to justice. For example:

If the vigilante was like Batman or Spiderman (beat up the badguys and left them behind for the police to lock up), the criminals lawyers will claim that their clients were denied due process (I believe thats the right term sorry not a legal expert), were unfairly searched and had their rights violated by being bludgeoned ect. ect. and the badguys would often be set free on such technicalities. It will literally be like the revolving door at Arkham Asylum...

Then, if they go the Punisher route and kill the bastards who deserve it, the police would be after them because murder is murder in the eyes of the law, even if its justifible. And unlike the comicbooks, police and forensics experts are a lot more proficient and will probably find the vigilante very quickly...

I'd love to see people dress up in costums and clean up the streets, and hopefully someone will be brave and smart enough to try that, but as long as we trade our freedom for protection (in the form of our laws) true vigilantism will be very difficult to enact. Kinda ironic, isnt it?
andyoung2002
andyoung2002 - 1/8/2009, 1:37 AM
i just cant see it happening. A person would have to devote their entire lives to the cause like the punisher with all the time, resources, prepping, and detective work needed. Like shadow said the baddies would be out in a heart beat due to the "criminal justice" system. They would have to out right kill those who they deem deserving of such punishment. With that in mind the people might allow it and even invite it but the law would put an end to it.
FrankGarret
FrankGarret - 1/8/2009, 3:55 AM
Bernie Goetz.
FrankGarret
FrankGarret - 1/8/2009, 5:18 AM
I'll admit it could happen, I'm even surprised it hasn't already happened. But I would have tons of problems with a vigilante.

Without powers, they'd probably be Batman styled, though probably without the high-tech gear, the training, the genius level IQ and the police cooperation. And as real criminals aren't all that stupid, cowardly and superstitious, these "vigilantes" would end up getting themselves killed pretty soon.

Or maybe they'd be Punisher-styled, in which case they'd also get themselves killed especially if they went against gangs and drug dealers, or if they opt for an easier target, it would be a matter of time before they did something incredibly stupid like going after brown people they think are terrorists.
ThunderCougarFalconBird
ThunderCougarFalconBird - 1/8/2009, 9:03 AM
Great question and very well put good sir!

There's only 2 ways I can think of a vigilante working in the real world. Said person would either have to have major connections to keep the government off his/her back, or have superpowers making them impossible to imprison. So I don't think a vigilante would get very far in the real world.

As for acceptance, even if they got the public vote the law would not allow this person to carry on. There have been many cases of people going to prison just for protecting themselves or loved ones so how can a vigilante even start up?

The main hurdle to jump is the the governments view of criminals. My personal opinion is that if someone has decided to act outside of the law then they wave their basic human rights. Unless the government saw things the same then a vigilante would be caught. But this will never happen as there are far too many grey areas such as crimes of passion or desperation, just to name 2!
BubbaDude
BubbaDude - 1/8/2009, 9:25 AM
As someone already said...in no way would the gov't allow masked vigilantes. Anyone who attempted it would be hounded by the law until they were captured or dead. The days of Jesse James or any other real life Robin Hood are (sadly?) over. It would take an olympic level martial artist with the funding of a Bill Gates to even try it, and even then, I don't think they'd last long.
As the old saying goes, "You might outrun one cop, but you ain't gonna outrun his radio." And, nowadays, the police have a lot more stuff than radios.

Even if some individual police were sympathetic to the vigilantes cause, many more would be more than willing to stop them.
Crusader
Crusader - 1/8/2009, 11:10 AM
To quote Harvey Dent

"You either die a hero, or live long enough to become the villian".

If there was someone who was saving people eventually he will make a mistake, and we will all blame him.
MasterExploder
MasterExploder - 1/8/2009, 11:45 AM
Go to your local barnes and noble and in the philosophy section look for a book called SUPERHEROS AND PHILOSOPHY. this question and MANY others are dealt with in detail. a fascinating read of essays written by actual philosophy proffessors on ethics and everythign else you could hope to ask.
Kilowog
Kilowog - 1/8/2009, 12:16 PM
If i had sweet ninja skills or crazy tech toys i would totaly be a vigilante. I wouldnt care if people didnt like me because i would be doing what i know is right. I would also like to go down in history as like the only vigilante ever who dressed up .
Crusader
Crusader - 1/8/2009, 1:22 PM
If there was someone superpowered the government would want in on it, better yet BUSH would want in on it. Either the metahuman is with the government or against it, and that's a lose-lose situation.If he's with the government America would probably take over the world, if he isn't with the goverment he's a criminal that would be an enemy to the nation. If he's the enemy the media would make him out to be a villian and people would believe that.
Bijous
Bijous - 1/8/2009, 4:19 PM
Bernhard "Subway Vigilante" Goetz tried to be a real-life Punisher. He was applauded, but got jail time:

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Bernhard_Goetz
Kilowog
Kilowog - 1/9/2009, 11:32 AM
Yeah Bijous but thats because he used a gun and wasnt wearing a superhero outfit.
destined2B
destined2B - 1/9/2009, 2:44 PM
I the U.S. a vigilante would be apprehended or maybe shot.I dont know about other parts of the world.The biggest problem I think would be what crimes would he consider worthy of his justice.I mean,a crime is a crime.Would he see murder as bad as theft,or rape as bad as simple vandalism?And as stated by adamant 877,he couldnt send anyone to jail,a lawyer would get them out and have a great case for a law suite,so he would have to kill them,or at least mark them,witch would put him on the wrong side.But the question of would he be excepted,I would have to say it is a 50/50 shot.But in 2 years he would have a movie made about him(especially if he has a way cool costume!!).But this is a top notch article,keep up the good work!
crappybumbum
crappybumbum - 1/11/2009, 12:12 PM
I think it'd be great for vigilantes to roam the streets and protect people but it wouldn't be enough to really drop the crime rate cuz people (gangs, crews, robbers, etc.) will come with bigger weapons and bigger groups. I think the only way a vigilante society would work is that there are people with years of fighting experience, martial arts experience, and more than one person going out. We don't have gadgets like Batman does so it'd be kinda hard to actually do it. But one day, someone's gonna go out there and try it. Sometime soon probably....
loganoneil
loganoneil - 1/21/2009, 12:09 PM
The idea of the vigilante is a somewhat noble but dangerous one. To protect and defend the innocent when no one else can or will should be applauded (as long as the line of talking of life is not crossed). The problem is that eventually you'd be overrun with 'wannabes' and gloryhound copycats who don't want to serve and protect, but do it solely for thrill and attention.

Crappybumbum brings up the good point of escallation - you fight back, the gangs come back with bigger, badder toys. In order to keep up, you have to 'up the ante'. Where does it stop? Eventually someone gets killed (probably you, the vigilante 'cause of that whole 'respect for life' thing - unless you're willing to break it, in which case you're no better than the thugs you're fighting).

There's also a fine line between the concept of 'vigilante' and 'thug'. Crusader pointed it out with the Harvey Dent line from 'Dark Knight', ""You either die a hero, or live long enough to become the villian," or in other words, "Absolute power corrupts absolutely."

Finally, there's the problem of identity protection. Protecting you identity while fighting crime is understandable (for your own safety, as well as the safety of the ones you love), but a colorful unitard and cape are pointless overkill (if you're running around trying to take down gangs in a 'Superman' outfit, you deserve to get your ass kicked!). The dorks on that show 'So You Want to be a Superhero' come to mind....
Marvelman09
Marvelman09 - 2/4/2009, 4:05 PM
I think the idea of a vigilante is great, as long as there morals and ethics are proper, i heard about a or a couple of vigilantes in the Great toronto area once , he or they beat up a thug that was trying to assault a woman, he/ they were called like the spade or something like that. the person or people helped the woman get a hold of the police afterward also. But that i guess was the closest to a vigilante i ever heard about
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