Reasons Why the X-Men and Spiderman Reboots May Be Destined For Trouble (In our eyes)

Reasons Why the X-Men and Spiderman Reboots May Be Destined For Trouble  (In our eyes)

Are we in for a treat...or another major letdown?

Editorial Opinion
By Nemesys - Jul 15, 2010 07:07 AM EST
Filed Under: X-Men

Reboots. This seems to be the trend in Hollywood these days, and not just with CBM’s. From Planet of the Apes to Alice in Wonderland to The Crow, it often seems there are no original ideas for flicks anymore. Although sometimes, just sometimes… a reboot or remake is needed to right the wrongs of previously done films that could have been so much better. But this leaves me with questions. What if the reboots are done wrong?? What if they only leave us disappointed again? What if, instead of correcting errors, they just create a new list of wrongs?

Case in point: Punisher. We’ve now had 3 attempts to make a good movie based on Frank Castle, the anti-hero known as the Punisher, none of which have been successful. Why is this? They’ve had some pretty big-name stars involved (John Travolta, Thomas Jane, Dolph Lundgren) with powerful Hollywood backing, but still they’ve failed. Could it involve the simple fact of not featuring the famous skull logo we all know and love? Is Punisher not a big enough name to draw the masses to the theaters? Could it be the lack of an anywhere-near accurate costume? Bad writing? Poor acting? All of the above??? Any way you slice it, they still never got it right.
From the looks of it, we may be in for the same issues with some of our other beloved comic book characters that are undergoing the reboot treatment as we speak. Below are some of the reasons I believe we may be underwhelmed by the reboots to come.

Lack of respect for the source material – Successful comic books are successful for a reason, or many reasons as it were. Readers fall in love with certain writers or certain artists because they portray the characters in a way that they can identify with, whether it's Wolverine’s gruff demeanor, Superman’s boy scout-like attitude, or Spidey’s wisecracks. Remove those character traits and, is Wolverine the same character? Is Spidey as entertaining? Give Thor a beard drawn by a sub-par inker, or have Mjolnir looking like some crappy stone mallet, would you still want a poster of that Thor on your wall? Understanding that some changes need to be made to appeal to larger audiences, change too much and you just simply have an altogether different product. 2nd Case in point: X-Men First Class. This story should feature the original 5, plus Prof. X and Magneto. Period. Why are characters being thrown in that were not a part of that stage of the team’s development? Emma Frost was not around the X-Men then, and she definitely was not a hero. She was the frikin White Queen of the Hellfire Club! (Now granted that while I am aware that the X-titles were retconned changing Emma into a good guy, please forgive me if any of the characters or story lines I mention have also been retconned and I am not aware. It’s been a long time since I have been able to buy and read my many titles religiously.) Why throw characters like her in the mix? Why Banshee? Why make Spiderman’s web shooting ability biological? Why put the X-Men in matching black leather uniforms like a boy band from the 70’s? These sort of changes show no respect for the source material, and it turns me off from the product as I’m sure it does for many of you.

Poor Casting – I’ll be honest, I don’t know what it’s like for a director to evaluate actors when they audition for roles, but sometimes their selections leave me scratching my head asking "WTF??" Some roles are cast spot on: Kelsey Grammer as Beast –pure brilliance, both Heath Ledger and Jack Nicholson as the Joker – grade A+ performances, Patrick Steward as Prof. X – perfect. But then there’s the other side of the spectrum: Kirsten Dunst as Mary Jane Watson – WTF?? The Governator as Mr. Freeze – WTF? Halle Berry as Storm?? Sure she’s gorgeous, but a mutant thief-turned-superhero from Africa? Not so much. Her performance was flat, and she didn’t even try to have an African accent!

So I worry about some of the casting choices being made for the reboots. Most of these actors I’m not even familiar with, but still I worry. Like James McAvoy as Professor X. Even with a bald head he doesn’t seem to have the look for the character, and I just don’t see him fitting the role of the wise, intelligent, most powerful mutant mind on the earth. But I will give these casting choices the benefit of the doubt until they prove that my fears had grounds.

Villain Choices – The perfect CBM needs the perfect villain as the antagonist. Who would Supes be without Luthor? Who would Spidey be without Electro, the Lizard, and Kingpin? Thor would be just another powerful god without Loki there to be a constant thorn in his side to help develop the character. We comment day and night on this site about villains we would love to see on the silver screen, and many times it seems that our pleas fall on deaf ears of the powers-that-be in Hollywood. Yet we go the see the movies anyway. How much more would we love and support these movies if our voices were heard and answered? Some studios may never know. I believe that the makers of the reboots have a moral responsibility to listen to the fans that pay our hard-earned coin to see these movies over and over again, and throw us a bone on issues like this. Let us see Electro project bolts of lightning as Spidey leaps and flips all over the place. Let us see the Sentinels in their full glory battle the X-Men all-out (even if it is only in the Danger Room). Give the fans the villains we want and I guarantee it would be a windfall at the box office.

Pandering to the Hollywood “suits” – Show of hands… who would love to see an R-rated Wolverine 2? What was that… all of us? Correct! But we’ve got about a snowballs chance in Muspelheim of that happening. Why? Less people to fill the seats due to the restricted rating. But come on!! I so geeked out to finally see Wolvie draw blood, and plunge his claws in the Hulk’s back on the animated Hulk vs. ! Kick Ass was a perfect example of how an R-rated CBM can work. Can you imagine a big budget gore-fest starring our favorite Canuck? But like I said, snowballs chance…

Sony/FOX – Last, but far from least, we have the perpetrators of our frustrations. After seeing the mighty Galactus reduced to the base form of a cloud (WTF???), all I can say is:

Marvel called, and they want their frikin rights back!!

Do you share my fears, or am I just over-analyzing? Discuss amongst yourselves.

Nemesys - There can be only one!

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Nemesys
Nemesys - 7/15/2010, 8:34 AM
No takers this morning?
vze21gwa
vze21gwa - 7/15/2010, 10:23 AM
I agree with some of the keypoints of the story, but not all of it. You mention "Give the fans the villains we want and I guarantee it would be a windfall at the box office". this isn't always so. one of the reasons spider-man 3 was a failure was because of venom. The studio wanted to do venom because everybody loved him. This caused the movie to fail. Also it would have been too much suspension of disbelief to have peter create his own web shooters. In regards to Xmen the first one was made 10 years ago. Nowadays they can put the sentinels but back then they couldn't. Think of them fighting five sentinels on an $80 million budget. It just wouldn't work.
vze21gwa
vze21gwa - 7/15/2010, 10:25 AM
Im actually looking forward to the Xmen reboot but not so much the spider-man reboot. Then again... as long as KIrsten Dunst isn't in it it should be okay.
CorndogBurglar
CorndogBurglar - 7/15/2010, 10:27 AM
don't be surprised if X-Men First Class is hokey and corny. The comics were. Also, with all the characters being teenagers, its going to be light hearted. i don't see this being good. I'll wait to see the trailer to pass judgement, but my hopes are very low.
Nemesys
Nemesys - 7/15/2010, 10:48 AM
@vze21gwa - I think S3 failed not because of Venom, but in spite of him. There was not enough of Venom for the fans since the main foe was Sandman. It also failed because of all the emo Peter crap they delved into. But, I agree with you on the Sentinal issue.

@CB - I hope it's not hokey, but then again, this is FOX were talking about so you're probably right!
Wolverine1974
Wolverine1974 - 7/15/2010, 11:00 AM
I can not agree more with you. Now granted Sony and Fox did put Marvel on the map as far as movies go with Spider-Man & X-Men, however, you hit the nail on the head with everything you said. Do you think that companies like Marvel/Disney would look at and listen to there fans if we said "hey we want to see a more darker side of Ironman? Well if the movies made no money what so ever they would. I think that Marvel/Disney need to pony up them high priced lawyers and fight the "Civil WAR" out of Sony and Fox for the rights to these charters before any more crappy movies get made!
Nemesys
Nemesys - 7/15/2010, 11:08 AM
@ Wolverine1974 - Here here! Well said.
TheLonelyComicBookNerd
TheLonelyComicBookNerd - 7/15/2010, 11:45 AM
Hahah I absolutely 100% agree with everything in this article!
Give Marvel there rights back! :D
flames809
flames809 - 7/15/2010, 11:53 AM
Alice and wonderland was a sequel not a reboot that's all i have to say
Brashlight
Brashlight - 7/15/2010, 11:55 AM
I agree pretty much with everything you said and i 1000% agree with the R-Rating fear every [frick]ing studio has. you can bring so much more depth to a character with an R-Rating. it keeps you from having the fear of going too far and pushing the PG-13 rating. you don't always need an R-Rating but for the parts like wolvie it is necessary. Hell do a google search on "Wolverine comic" and count how many bloody claw pictures you see, a sh!t ton! PG-13 does not = Wolverine!
screams
screams - 7/15/2010, 12:13 PM
These articles are the reason I check this site everyday.

I agree with everything you said.

Someone needs to write an article about the rights Sony and Fox have and what the terms are, what would give Marvel back the rights? I've heard they have to make a movie every 5 years or something like that, but wouldn't we be hearing news about movies like Daredevil going back to Marvel by now?
Nemesys
Nemesys - 7/15/2010, 12:15 PM
@ Kid Zombie - I would still call First Class a reboot for one simple reason: HOPEFULLY they will not be sticking with the continuum from the Origins movies, or the 3 existing X-Men movies. If they did, Bobby could never had been a teenager at the school like he was in X1, 2 & 3. He was the youngest of the original 5, but that would still put him nowhere near Rogue's or Kitty's age.
Nemesys
Nemesys - 7/15/2010, 12:17 PM
@ screams - I have no idea the terms of the contracts the studios have. That would definitely be interesting to know however. And thanks for the kudos! Keep checking everyday!
JonSolo
JonSolo - 7/15/2010, 12:22 PM
Nice article!
The part about changing things up to the point that it isnt the same product is spot on..Whats the point of taking our heroes and villians and reducing them to something different.
Brashlight
Brashlight - 7/15/2010, 12:26 PM
I agree with just about everything you said especially the R-Rating! That is something I have been wanting for CBM's for ever now. Like you said just look at Kick-Ass! Wildly successful and had an R-Rating. Its not just so you can put more violence and Nudity in those movies (which i am totally ok with) but you can ad more depth to characters if your not so worried about keeping it PG-13. I think directors become so restricted by what they can do keeping it at PG-13 that they aren't able to add subtle touches and tweeks to a character and this keeps them one dimensional and lifeless. Good article
Nemesys
Nemesys - 7/15/2010, 12:32 PM
@ JonSolo - Thanks bud!

@ Brashlight - It would even be satisfying to see a director's cut on the DVD with all the scenes that were cut to make it PG-13, in effect giving us the R-rated movie we want to see. Just an idea! And of course, I'm cool with blood and boobies any day of the week!
ManThing
ManThing - 7/15/2010, 12:40 PM
I will NEVER watch the Spider - man reboot.

Maybe I will give First Class a chance if the trailer looks good, but I doubt it.
Wolverine1974
Wolverine1974 - 7/15/2010, 12:40 PM
@nemesys: correct me if I'm wrong, but doesn't the mutant gene take effect at puberty? That would make Iceman "Bobby" around what 8 to 10 years old at the youngest when his powers manifested?? On another note maybe we as CBM fans should start a letter writing campaign to Fox and Sony to let them know how we really feel about this situation. Not only that we should also write Marvel/Disney and tell them how we support them and ask how we can help them to get the rights back so we can see the movies we want to see!!
krooklyn72
krooklyn72 - 7/15/2010, 12:52 PM
Jeez. Maybe cuz I'm not a fanatic about comic books and original stories that characters were created. But, I don't see why it matters soooo much. I mean, hell, most of these characters were created before a number of us was even born. I think it's a necessary evil to update character origins and even stories to fit in a modern time.
ButtNakedSmurf
ButtNakedSmurf - 7/15/2010, 12:57 PM
Thomas Jane was the SHIT as the Punisher and if anyone disagrees w me they can go [frick] themselvecuz that movie was 100% awseome
mercwithamouf
mercwithamouf - 7/15/2010, 12:59 PM
they mess up every cbm in one way or another..i agree with u and ur point of the source material..sm3 failed so hard when it came to everything not only venom..(they messed up his costume, made him screech like a got-damn velociraptor, and didnt have that much of a "multi-personality"),also making harry into a good guy and havin him team up with spidey was gay..emo-bangs..dancing..pretty much all together was a bad look.i never understood y studios cant just read a comic and say "lets turn that into a movie" i mean when people make movies they draw up story boards right?..well a comic is a friggin story board already made for u..how hard is it to go offa that? make minor changes to make it do-able in a movie..its what everyone wants and has been sayin since forever..but its not gonna stop..cause no matter what everyone is gonna go see these shitty movies in the theatre no matter how far from the source material it may be..look at wolverine's butchered ass story (baraka-pool)..kick ass, sin city, watchmen, 300, dark knight..all did great..and movie execs. wonder y??..wake the eff up reh-tards..make a movie worth watching then u get money..dont worry bout the money and not give a eff bout the material..sorry i wrote so much..just needed to say it.
Creature
Creature - 7/15/2010, 1:14 PM
Jackman promised Wolverine 2 to have the premise of Frank Miller's story. We. Are. Screwed.
statzy95
statzy95 - 7/15/2010, 1:17 PM
@ Nemesys. Your case in point, Punisher, can be summed up in that he needs more than one movie to develop the character for the movie medium. His character is more complex than just a one shot revenge character. As I have said on the Jeph Loeb EVP of TV, or whatever he is article, Punisher would be a great fit for a TV series. That way they could keep his story going to show where he goes after he gets his revenge. Really develop him into the antihero he is. A two hour movie just isn’t enough time to fit it all in.
Characters are just that, characters. Look it up. The appearance of a character is free to change as long as what He/She stands for remains the same. The very nature of comics and graphic novels play right into that truth. For instance, Superman drawn by Michael Turner can look totally different than Superman drawn by, say, Alex Ross. Characters can look however we want them to, as long as what they stand for remains the same.
Source material may need to be disrespected (hopefully as little as possible) to try and ground the story in reality, especially if it is a live action interpretation. Take Galactus, for example, the foggy cloud. I would easily say that he was not “the” cloud but that was what they showed of him. Haven’t you ever seen any classic movies with a person playing the role of Jesus? I can’t think of any titles right now, but they never used to show his face, it was considered disrespectful. No, I’m not comparing Galactus to Jesus, just trying to illiterate that if a being that powerful exists; we may not know what he would look like. They just used a cloud to have something to show on screen, to keep it more realistic. Even if a world existed where four scientists gained super powers in an experiment gone wrong, would you be able to believe that a giant human the size of planets was able to devour them? In a blue and purple gladiator suit, with a painted medieval helmet, and horns? Probably not. It’s a little too far out there for the real world, but it works in comics, nonetheless.
I will, however, agree with you on the ratings thing. Hollywood does need to realize that they are making a lot of money off of adults that have grown up with these characters. Some more adult themes would work and sell very well. Although, Disney buying Marvel to tap the 13-18 year old male market will probably be the death of that though.
Nemesys
Nemesys - 7/15/2010, 2:04 PM
@ Wolverine1974 - Thats probably closer to ages 10 - 13 years old when the powers manifest. And I'd be down for the letter writing campaign!

@ mercwithamouf - Exactly!


@ statzy95 - I could definitely see a Punisher tv series, I agree the character could be fleshed out much better in that medium. As for the cloud thing, if they're asking us to believe in a man covered in rock walking the streets with his friend flying above him completely engulfed in flames, and a guy stretching like a rubber band on roids, then we should be able to believe in a giant entity in a gladiator suit from outer space that will threaten the very existance of our planet. In for a penny, in for a pound!
Nemesys
Nemesys - 7/15/2010, 2:09 PM
@ Gattsu - LOL! I agree on Wanted! I didn't even know that was a comic book until right before the movie came out. I guess its just a different type of CMB, being a non-superhero movie and all. Like Sin City, I guess.
AVEN
AVEN - 7/15/2010, 2:12 PM
Is X-Men first class a reboot??

Meh, yeah those movies smell like other Hollywood "trash" but the people will go to see it, ohh the irony....
breakUbatman
breakUbatman - 7/15/2010, 2:12 PM
statzy95 I agree with you as I and other,s have said before give the Punisher to HBO or Showtime.

As for Galactus I bought that Cloud-reality cra p for a while but then look at the day the Earth Stood Still or Watchmen where there were giant beings on screen. I mean C'mon, C'MON.

The Punisher flopped in my opinion because they deviated too much from the comics. If they just took Punisher Max In The Beginning and adapted it we'd have one heck of a movie but they watered down charcters and introduced Jigsaw. It was a failed attempt at merging two different versions of one character.
mercwithamouf
mercwithamouf - 7/15/2010, 2:12 PM
also..whats the point of a reboot if ur just gonna eff it up and do it justice??..so u can reboot the reboot?
TrollHunter
TrollHunter - 7/15/2010, 2:40 PM
I got news for everyone - X-Men: First Class is not a reboot...
CaptainJack
CaptainJack - 7/15/2010, 2:48 PM
I'm all for some reboots...when it's necessary. What I don't get is rebooting successful franchises. If it's successful, there is obviously a fan base that appreciates. I guess I'm just wondering if we aren't seeing reboots just for the sake of rebooting because it happens to be a trend right now. If that's the case, where does it end and what's next?
Nemesys
Nemesys - 7/15/2010, 2:49 PM
@ TrollHunter & AVEN - A reprint of why I think it IS a reboot: I would still call First Class a reboot for one simple reason: HOPEFULLY they will not be sticking with the continuum from the Origins movies, or the 3 existing X-Men movies. If they did, Bobby could never had been a teenager at the school like he was in X1, 2 & 3. He was the youngest of the original 5, but that would still put him nowhere near Rogue's or Kitty's age. Iceman was an X-veteran by the time they joined the team.
AVEN
AVEN - 7/15/2010, 3:49 PM
@Nemesys

But they won't use Iceman and Angel in this movie...
comicb00kguy
comicb00kguy - 7/15/2010, 4:05 PM
Excellent editorial! Lack of respect for the source material is a primary, if not THE primary reason for so many failed comic book movies. You sound like me with some of those great observations!

Gotta nitpick about the Superman/Luthor thing. Even non-readers would enjoy seeing Superman fight somebody else for once. Luthor is beyond played out. Give him a rest already!
TrollHunter
TrollHunter - 7/15/2010, 4:11 PM
@Nemesys
So u are hoping its a reboot? Why? Im so sick of reboots and reimaginings, they need to just stick with whats happened in the films universe. Does iceman and angel REALLY need to be in first class? no. with the characters they are casting, it could turn out to be a much more interesting story. and having 3 out of 5 of the comics version of first class aint bad. Theyve already cast Beast, there close to casting Cyclops, and Jean Grey is pretty much a shoe in for this movie so excpect an announcement soon. Theyve also cast Banshee and Havok. So instead of Cyclops, Jean Grey, Beast, Iceman and Angel we've got Cyclops, Jean Grey, Beast, Banshee and Havok. Thats a pretty good line up, especially considering Havok and Cyclops are borthers so thatll make things interesting. And who doesnt want to see Banshee kick sum ass?
AshleyWilliams
AshleyWilliams - 7/15/2010, 4:31 PM
Wait? Andrew Garfield as Spider-Man is a horrible casting choice? Fassbender as Magneto? Both AMAZING choices.
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